Author Topic: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing  (Read 21294 times)

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Offline LakeTrax

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #75 on: February 18, 2014, 12:57:54 am »
Brian may be right? Hey, we're just discussing stuff here, no need to go nuts and start making insane accusations....  ;D
......
I should have made that comment last night in BOLD ITALICS! :rotflmao:

.......
Seriously, I do not find my C-14 to act abruptdly, suddenly or in any other way other than exactly as I would expect and prefer.
.......
I believe you Brian... and neither have any of the other motorcycles that I've ridden/owned that were properly tuned and had the secondary 'flies removed.

The entire debate/problem is that when you remove the secondary 'flies on a 2nd gen. C14, the TC system is "supposedly" affected in a negative way...
Without pulling 'em and finding out for myself, I don't know who to believe... Who's advice should I/we be taking as gospel? There have been conflicting reports on this for a long time, and personally I believe it has more to do with the rider's sensitivity to such things than the simple "TC doesn't work well with the 'flies removed" regurgitated response. This is why I'm stoked to hear about this new WRT equipment and to read about guys like Cory that are doin' the leg-work(at home) to possibly find the "best-of-both worlds" settings.

Hey... if I owned an 08-09 model, my 'flies would have already been removed too. :-[

Offline nando

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #76 on: February 18, 2014, 02:05:39 am »
I have never removed my flies. I don't see how some of you guys do that and function...I guess you have to slide your pants off and sit-down like a girl to whizz...people nowadays!
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Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #77 on: March 08, 2014, 10:26:00 pm »
Sooo, back to this WRT software...

Have any of you guys tried your Woolich kits yet?

I installed and tested an On-Bike harness today, so I can now flash my ECU without removing it from the bike.

The weather is starting to warm up and everything is melting, so I should be out road testing in a couple weeks! ;D

Is everybody else still covered in snow??...lol.
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Offline Jeff Kerkow

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #78 on: March 08, 2014, 10:38:03 pm »
Still covered in snow. Did you decide if you were going to share your map ? I am just curios as to where you ended up STP plate opening point ? I have to get out and at least try mine connections a week before the Tech session.
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Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #79 on: March 08, 2014, 10:57:41 pm »
Still covered in snow. Did you decide if you were going to share your map ? I am just curios as to where you ended up STP plate opening point ? I have to get out and at least try mine connections a week before the Tech session.

The snow is going fast here, but it's still piled high in places. Roads will be dirty for a little while yet.
It was 40 degrees today...I would have been riding if the roads were clean (and I had my parts that are on back order).

I don't mind sharing any maps, but not until I test them myself on the road.
Can't do a proper test in the garage, and I don't want to send out any maybes.

I'll send you what I have as soon as I finish it. ;D

Rem :great:




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Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #80 on: March 22, 2014, 05:21:04 pm »
Hey LSGiant,

I see the BIN file for the newer (2011-up) C14's is now available in the WRT software, so you should be good to go whenever you get around to reading your ECU (with no delays).

There's a 2nd gen European C14 BIN file loaded up now too, in case you wanted to have a look at it. Looks to be pretty much the same as ours, except it's a little leaner at idle;).

I have another Kawi ECU to flash now...just picked up a ZX6R/636 ECU today and will be flashing it shortly.

Spring is in the air folks...I'll be on the road next weekend if this mild weather keeps up;).

Cheers,
Rem ;D



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Offline Jeff Kerkow

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #81 on: March 22, 2014, 06:39:25 pm »
trying PM sent
It's not a competition, It's a demonstration. "Rowan"
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Offline Jeff Kerkow

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #82 on: March 29, 2014, 11:33:23 pm »
I was at a our COG session today and was able to hook up and talk to my my ECU today. It all worked great. I am busy for the next few weeks but i will get my map written and give it a try.

Stay tuned :)
It's not a competition, It's a demonstration. "Rowan"
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Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #83 on: March 29, 2014, 11:49:24 pm »
I was at a our COG session today and was able to hook up and talk to my my ECU today. It all worked great. I am busy for the next few weeks but i will get my map written and give it a try.

Stay tuned :)

Cool beans LSGiant! That's great. I think you'll have some fun with it.

If all goes well, I'll have some tuned maps for you to try in a few weeks.

Keep us posted!!

Cheers,
Cory ;D
“If you're not a liberal at twenty you have no heart, if you're not a conservative at forty you have no brain.” ~ Winston Churchill.

Offline Jeff Kerkow

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #84 on: March 30, 2014, 12:29:13 am »
I know what I want to do should only take me an hour or so to modify the maps. I like dumping the data to Excel and then tweaking and then moving it back.  It was nice to go back and read through the thread. I think I have enough data to decide where I want to start my STPs opening. I look forward to spanking the FJR guys I ride with when we do high gear roll ons.
It's not a competition, It's a demonstration. "Rowan"
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Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #85 on: March 30, 2014, 12:55:38 am »
Excellent!

Something to keep in mind, when you write a modified BIN File to the ECU, make use of the notes section. I have been writing the name of the BIN File in there...whatever name you decide to give it, etc. This is the only way to know what BIN File you have loaded. If you go back and 'read' your ECU again, you will see in the notes what BIN File it is. I thought that the ECU saved the name that I gave the modified BIN Files, but it does not. Just FYI.

Have fun with it, and keep us posted on your progress and results!

Nice work LS!

Cory ;D
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Offline Jeff Kerkow

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #86 on: March 30, 2014, 01:05:37 am »
Thanks for the tip I had also assumed the file would change. Did you determine if there was a different STP map for ECO and normal mode ?

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Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #87 on: March 30, 2014, 11:18:47 am »
Thanks for the tip I had also assumed the file would change. Did you determine if there was a different STP map for ECO and normal mode ?

Currently we only have access to the 'normal' mode STP maps. The Map Select (0/1) tab in the WRT software is a carry over from some of the sportbike models where you can switch between different maps. It doesn't do anything in our C14 maps. For your STP changes, use the map that opens by default, Map Select (0).

We do have full access to the fuel and ignition maps for ECO mode, but I personally have no plans to touch them. My curiosity on the ECO mode STP maps has passed as I really don't plan on touching ECO mode anyway. Woolich is going to spend some more time on the C14 BIN Files again soon, so we may end up with some more access...maybe the ECO mode STP maps, or fan temp control, etc.

Cheers,
Cory



 

« Last Edit: March 30, 2014, 11:24:00 am by Rembrant »
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Offline Jon

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #88 on: April 09, 2014, 06:37:52 pm »
Please forgive my ignorance here  :-[, but I am not understanding why you would need both the pcv w/auto tune and this. Don't both of these accomplish similar changes to the bike? I get the Wollrich does not have maps pre-built and you would need to do your own tweeking vs the pcv, but I am not understanding why both are needed, or how you would use both together. I guess what I don't understand is what the Wollrich gives you that the pcv does not.
Does the pcv have the ability to change the mapping for the secondary butterfly's?   ???

Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #89 on: April 09, 2014, 07:30:59 pm »
Please forgive my ignorance here  :-[, but I am not understanding why you would need both the pcv w/auto tune and this. Don't both of these accomplish similar changes to the bike? I get the Wollrich does not have maps pre-built and you would need to do your own tweeking vs the pcv, but I am not understanding why both are needed, or how you would use both together. I guess what I don't understand is what the Wollrich gives you that the pcv does not.
Does the pcv have the ability to change the mapping for the secondary butterfly's?   ???

Hi Jon,

There isn't really a quick answer to your question(s), but you're right...in most case you wouldn't need both a PC5 with Autotune, and the Woolich DIY ECU software. You may have read earlier on that I have both, but it's only because of the way I ordered things with the scheduling, and I ended up with both.

To summarize it, the PC5 is a fuel controller....and that's all it does. The Autotune gives you greater control and ability to tune the map yourself, but you're still only controlling the fuel.

When making changes inside the ECU, there are more options....you can adjust the secondary butterfly opening, ignition timing, fuel maps, and you can adjust the RPM limits and disable the top speed limiter, etc. It doesn't matter if you do it yourself with the Woolich software or if you have another company flash the ECU for you, there are a few more options available.
The companies that specialize in flashing ECU's have pre-made maps they can load into the ECU's. With the Woolich DIY software, there are currently no pre-made maps for the Concours-14, but only because it is a new addition to the software. As C14 owners start tuning their bikes and sharing their maps, there will be options available later on.

There is a way to transfer PC5 maps into the ECU's, and people have been doing this successfully, so that's where the two full systems come into play. Building your own maps using the PC5, loading them into the ECU, and then fine tuning again and again until you get it where you want it. Definitely not for everybody.

There are lots of guys running flashed ECU's and still running PC5's on top of them (on other Kawis). I don't think this would be required on a sport-touring bike like the Concours-14, but for the guys looking for absolute peak performance, it seems the best way is to do it with both (like drag racing for example).

Hope that helps.

Rem ;D
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Offline BDF

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #90 on: April 09, 2014, 07:46:18 pm »
This post reminds me- did you ever get the auto tune add- on gadget working on the C-14? The one from Woolich? As I remember, the wiring harness was for a ZX 14 and there was some question as to whether or not it would work on a C-14.... if I remember correctly? And of course, the C-14 needs a bung welded in the exhaust and an O2 sensor no matter what system is used to close the loop. I guess I am just checking up on where you are with that overall?

Brian


Hi Jon,

There isn't really a quick answer to your question(s), but you're right...in most case you wouldn't need both a PC5 with Autotune, and the Woolich DIY ECU software. You may have read earlier on that I have both, but it's only because of the way I ordered things with the scheduling, and I ended up with both.

<snip>

Rem ;D
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Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #91 on: April 09, 2014, 08:09:43 pm »
This post reminds me- did you ever get the auto tune add- on gadget working on the C-14? The one from Woolich? As I remember, the wiring harness was for a ZX 14 and there was some question as to whether or not it would work on a C-14.... if I remember correctly? And of course, the C-14 needs a bung welded in the exhaust and an O2 sensor no matter what system is used to close the loop. I guess I am just checking up on where you are with that overall?

Brian

Yes and no...lol. What I did get working was the On-Bike harness. The ZX14R uses the same harness, but wired to different pins on the FI ECU. All this allows me to do at this point and time is it gives me the ability to flash my FI ECU without removing it from the bike. All I have to do is take the seat off.
The Woolich Racing kit for the C14 has only a bench-harness as standard equipment, and you have to have an external 12vdc supply for power.

I am going to be using the Woolich LBP, which is their version of Autotune. I should have an update for you in a couple weeks. It may take a little bit to get it sorted out, but it is a really slick system in how it works.

The biggest benefit for me personally will be in tuning the FI ECU after I get the ZX14 TB's installed (later). I see the guys have been having some low throttle response issues, and off-idle abruptness, which I'm hoping I can fine tune in my own ECU.

I will also have a custom tuned map or two that I can share with LSGiant and whoever else have their own kit that might want to try it. It's just going to take me a little time to get it all done.

Cheers,
Cory

« Last Edit: April 09, 2014, 08:13:12 pm by Rembrant »
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Offline Jon

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #92 on: April 09, 2014, 08:21:46 pm »
Rem,
Thanks for clearing that up for me. Based on what I knew about the systems this is what I thought would be the case.
I just bought an 08 connie about a month ago and am starting to make it my own. My original plan was to do a pcv w/ auto tune over the next winter season, but saw the posts about the secondary butterfly's and figured this would be a good thing to do as well!  >:D  So I am trying to figure out what path I should take. When I have time, I do like doing a lot of mod's myself, so having the ability to manage the ECU would be nice. On the other side, I am pretty much on the bike every free second so that means I dont have a lot of free time :).

So I guess my question is, which path would you suggest? I do like to tinker, but don't boat loads of time to do all the trial and error myself....  >:(

Thanks,

Jon

Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #93 on: April 09, 2014, 08:46:38 pm »

So I guess my question is, which path would you suggest? I do like to tinker, but don't boat have loads of time to do all the trial and error myself.

Thanks,

Jon

If you like to tinker with stuff yourself, I suggest getting a PC5....and you don't really even need the Autotune as there are already some great maps around for the C14. The Autotune is a nice addition/option, but depending on what you're doing and what your goal is, you may not need it. To get the most out of a PC5, you'll have to remove the secondary butterfly plates, so there is at least a little bit of wrench work involved. Lots and lots of info on that here;).

The Woolich DIY ECU kit is great too, but there currently are no pre-made maps available...you would have to have the bike tuned, by somebody that works with ECU tuning, and has a dyno, etc.

There is also the Guhl Motors option. They can flash your ECU for you, with a performance fuel map and butterflies that open much earlier. You can't tinker with it yourself, but it is a good option.

Hope that helps,
Rem ;D
 
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Offline gPink

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #94 on: April 09, 2014, 09:30:16 pm »
Rem, are you pulling the flies from the zx tb's?

Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #95 on: April 09, 2014, 09:33:11 pm »
Rem, are you pulling the flies from the zx tb's?

Well, I already have, yes...because I've had them for a while and they're on the bench. It was easy. However, I may re-install the flies before I install the ZX TB's....it really kind of depends on where I am with everything by the time I'm ready to install, and when my full system finally arrives.

Rem ;D
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Offline LakeTrax

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #96 on: April 10, 2014, 01:25:49 am »
You're still waiting on the exhaust??? :-\  >:( :(
I thought you ordered that thing months ago... :017:

What's lead-time on an Area-P system supposed to be? Seems too long-

Offline JS_racer

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #97 on: April 10, 2014, 09:35:49 am »

So I guess my question is, which path would you suggest? I do like to tinker, but don't boat have loads of time to do all the trial and error myself.

Thanks,

Jon

.....
There is also the Guhl Motors option. They can flash your ECU for you, with a performance fuel map and butterflies that open much earlier. You can't tinker with it yourself, but it is a good option.

Hope that helps,
Rem ;D

I went this route and am very pleased with the results.  :beerchug:

Offline Rembrant

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #98 on: April 10, 2014, 10:15:46 am »
You're still waiting on the exhaust???

Yup...sure am...lol.

I thought you ordered that thing months ago...

Yup...sure did, ordered and paid for on October 14th 2013 to be exact...lol.

What's lead-time on an Area-P system supposed to be? Seems too long-

I think 'normal' delivery was usually 1-3 months, depending on when you placed your order. I know of at least one member on here that ordered his after me, and received it in 4-6 weeks. Last update I got was that the delivery was "trending towards the end of April"...so I'll have to follow up again in a couple weeks.

The issue apparently is that Area-P moved the C14 full exhaust system from R&D Fabrication into production batch runs, and the transition has been delayed...several times now.

Oh well...I'm a patient guy...and there's nothing else I want, so I'll wait. I waited 9 months for a replacement Akrapovic muffler one time...but I was starting to get impatient by the end of it...lol.

Cheers,
Cory
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Offline Turbo

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Re: Woolrich DIY ECU Flashing
« Reply #99 on: April 11, 2014, 11:37:33 am »
I just used the woolich software yesterday to tune my 2012 ZX1OR. It works good, but can be complicated, and confusing. It is definitly more difficult and time consuming than tuning with a power commander. Ultimately you can do more, but it could easily overwhelm, and confuse people. One thing that is strange is how Kawasaki does the ram air compensation. I always though they would use the intake air pressure sensor to compensate for the change in air pressure from the ram air, but they actually just do it my MPH. You can clearly see it on the dyno. You run the bike in 4th and it shows a certain mixture, then 5th gear shows richer, and then 6th gear even richer. For the person trying to tune it themselves at home by seat of the pants, I could see them really getting lost, and chasing their tail. You would really need to get their log box pro, so you could datalog and then make your changes. I ended up with 192.66 HP at 13,400 and it held to 190 at 14,000. We also weighed the bike and it weighed 390 LBS with a half tank of fuel. It should be a fun cruiser. Mike.