Author Topic: yet another horn upgrade/install  (Read 15094 times)

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Offline Big-Al

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #25 on: December 20, 2014, 10:52:27 am »

I am aware of cutting the fairing but choose not to do so at this time. First, canyon cage R&R isn't that difficult with the right tools. Second, side fairing removal situations can often be side-stepped by removing top plastic, side/back fasteners and flexing (and bracing) the side fairing (backside) allowing for quite a bit of space to fiddle around in. I have made adjustments to Rostra linkage and other minor mechanics by doing this. Saves lots of time over complete fairing removal. Of course, forward access (radiator area) requires complete removal.


Every time you take those bolts out, they weaken. The Kawasaki service manual is clear about limited reuse of engine mount bolts. For at least one of them they require service personnel to replace with a new bolt each time it is removed. I'm sure MCE says something about it somewhere.

Regarding your above statement... bolts are weakened (and need replacement) when over-tightened (see below quote and link), not loosened, yes? The aluminum threads are the weak link/fail point and not the bolt. Heli-coils would work wonders to "beef-up" the mount. I looked in the Kawasaki service manual (engine R&R sections) but couldn't find anything regarding engine mount bolts re-use. Where did you find that? I couldn't find anything in the MCE documentation either... in fact MCE says to retain all original hardware for possible future re-use.

"All of the elongation applied within the elastic range is relieved when the load is removed. The amount of elongation increases when more load is applied. When a bolt is stressed beyond its proof load (maximum load under which a bolt will behave in an elastic manner), the elastic elongation changes to plastic deformation and the strain will no longer be proportional to stress."

From: http://www.enerpac.com/en-us/bolting-theory

I know many will chime in and say "oh I take mine out all the time....." and I agree, there is a serviceable life to those bolts beyond recommended usage. But why push it? All you have to do is make two trivial cuts that can't even be seen and make no difference to panel stability, and you never have to remove an engine bolt again.

I said "choose not to do so at this time"... LOL. If fairing R&R becomes too frequent a hassle (it hasn't so far), I will cut the fairing.

I too have done some work by just removing fasteners in the "back" and pulling the panel(s) outward to do something simple. But you could never hang a compressor beside the reservoir without removing the panel completely.

Yes... this is one of the reasons why I mounted the compressor next to the Rostra controller (top right)... easy access to all components and a short tubing run to the horn.

YMMV

2012 Kawasaki Concours (Arabian Red) (1400cc)
2008 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
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1980 BMW R100 RT (1000cc)
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Offline Big-Al

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #26 on: December 20, 2014, 06:13:52 pm »
A picture of compressor mount location snuggled next to Rostra controller.

2012 Kawasaki Concours (Arabian Red) (1400cc)
2008 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
2004 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
1998 BMW K1200RS (1200cc)
1991 BMW K1 (1000cc)
1986 BMW K100 LT (1000cc)
1980 BMW R100 RT (1000cc)
1975 BMW R90/6 (900cc)
1972 BSA Lightning (750cc)
1970 Norton Commando (750cc)
1969 Triumph Bonneville (650cc)
1968 Harley Davidson Sprint (250cc)
1967 Honda Super Hawk (305cc)
1967 Honda Cub (65cc)

Offline Bruiser

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #27 on: December 21, 2014, 06:07:46 am »
Fred and JR , those are both very nice installs
Bruiser

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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #28 on: December 26, 2014, 08:27:31 pm »
I find this all a bit humerous about the BadBoy horn.. and trying to mount it and cobble up something.
I have one sitting here, along with my Rostra cruise, both uninstalled, but I was curious when I got the horn, and made a bunch of jumpers with alligator clips, just to hear it... I stuck it inside the upper right fairing, just laid it in there fully assembled on some foam rubber padding, and tried it..
Man, its f'n loud, then stuck it on the front fender.. there is no discrenable difference, unless you are holding a db meter at 5 ft, and really care about a 1db loss..
Mount it vertically as the prescribe, up in the right front... and its still frikkn loud.
 :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :))

I look back in time, remembering people that actually cut holes in the front of the fairing to place the horn opening to road spray, just so they had "the most sound output" what a hoot....
Bury it, keep it dry, it will out last the engine. :rotflmao:
« Last Edit: December 26, 2014, 08:30:55 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

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Offline patatty

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2015, 03:47:00 am »

Obviously just get your air line tip threaded into the horn before putting the horn on the bike. 


What type/size adapter are you using to connect the hose to the plastic horn?  Are you force threading it in or tapping it first?

Offline mattchewn

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #30 on: January 04, 2015, 04:20:36 am »
patatty,
I was able to find a brass nipple that threaded directly into the horn assembly at Home Depot. Since it was such a good fit I did not even bother to tap threads into the plastic. IIRC it was a 1/8 pipe thread to 3/8" nipple.
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Offline patatty

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #31 on: January 04, 2015, 04:14:08 pm »
patatty,
I was able to find a brass nipple that threaded directly into the horn assembly at Home Depot. Since it was such a good fit I did not even bother to tap threads into the plastic. IIRC it was a 1/8 pipe thread to 3/8" nipple.
Matt

Thanks Matt.

Scott

Offline Gypsy JR

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #32 on: January 05, 2015, 08:47:06 am »

Obviously just get your air line tip threaded into the horn before putting the horn on the bike. 


What type/size adapter are you using to connect the hose to the plastic horn?  Are you force threading it in or tapping it first?

I used a urethane barb fitting which was a press fit into the plastic horn. Then, before putting it in permanently I coated it with plastic epoxy (the kind specifically for all plastics and hard rubber materials) and pressed it in. Its never coming out.  :great:
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Offline Big-Al

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #33 on: January 05, 2015, 07:26:15 pm »
I tapped both the horn (plastic) and compressor (metal) and used a nylon (threaded at one end, hose barb at the other) part I found at Ace Hardware. I used teflon tape on the threads to ensure no leakage. The same nylon part snugly fit both the horn and compressor.
2012 Kawasaki Concours (Arabian Red) (1400cc)
2008 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
2004 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
1998 BMW K1200RS (1200cc)
1991 BMW K1 (1000cc)
1986 BMW K100 LT (1000cc)
1980 BMW R100 RT (1000cc)
1975 BMW R90/6 (900cc)
1972 BSA Lightning (750cc)
1970 Norton Commando (750cc)
1969 Triumph Bonneville (650cc)
1968 Harley Davidson Sprint (250cc)
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Offline patatty

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #34 on: January 05, 2015, 09:38:30 pm »
I used a urethane barb fitting which was a press fit into the plastic horn. Then, before putting it in permanently I coated it with plastic epoxy (the kind specifically for all plastics and hard rubber materials) and pressed it in. Its never coming out.  :great:

I tapped both the horn (plastic) and compressor (metal) and used a nylon (threaded at one end, hose barb at the other) part I found at Ace Hardware. I used teflon tape on the threads to ensure no leakage. The same nylon part snugly fit both the horn and compressor.

Thank you both!

Offline Gypsy JR

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #35 on: January 08, 2015, 11:42:56 am »
I used a urethane barb fitting which was a press fit into the plastic horn. Then, before putting it in permanently I coated it with plastic epoxy (the kind specifically for all plastics and hard rubber materials) and pressed it in. Its never coming out.  :great:

I tapped both the horn (plastic) and compressor (metal) and used a nylon (threaded at one end, hose barb at the other) part I found at Ace Hardware. I used teflon tape on the threads to ensure no leakage. The same nylon part snugly fit both the horn and compressor.

Thank you both!

If I remember, you don't have to tap the compressor side (at least, on a Stebel Nautilus), it has the kind of bulb-end fitting a hose fits over and you use a clamp.

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Offline Big-Al

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #36 on: January 08, 2015, 01:28:17 pm »
I used a urethane barb fitting which was a press fit into the plastic horn. Then, before putting it in permanently I coated it with plastic epoxy (the kind specifically for all plastics and hard rubber materials) and pressed it in. Its never coming out.  :great:

I tapped both the horn (plastic) and compressor (metal) and used a nylon (threaded at one end, hose barb at the other) part I found at Ace Hardware. I used teflon tape on the threads to ensure no leakage. The same nylon part snugly fit both the horn and compressor.

Thank you both!

If I remember, you don't have to tap the compressor side (at least, on a Stebel Nautilus), it has the kind of bulb-end fitting a hose fits over and you use a clamp.

Not on a Wolo... refer to the picture I posted on 12/20 that shows the tapped compressor...
2012 Kawasaki Concours (Arabian Red) (1400cc)
2008 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
2004 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
1998 BMW K1200RS (1200cc)
1991 BMW K1 (1000cc)
1986 BMW K100 LT (1000cc)
1980 BMW R100 RT (1000cc)
1975 BMW R90/6 (900cc)
1972 BSA Lightning (750cc)
1970 Norton Commando (750cc)
1969 Triumph Bonneville (650cc)
1968 Harley Davidson Sprint (250cc)
1967 Honda Super Hawk (305cc)
1967 Honda Cub (65cc)

Offline Gypsy JR

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #37 on: January 10, 2015, 09:32:27 am »
Ah, difference in horn makes then. With the Stebel, you don't have to bother tapping the compressor for the inlet hose, which saves a step.
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Offline RideBellChain

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #38 on: January 10, 2015, 06:39:32 pm »
JC,  for Canyon Cages go to mcenterprises.com   Or Amazon, I bought mine there...I think.  There are other sources I can't remember.

I mounted my horn(s)  a bit different than most.  Suspended from the black plastic panels on both sides of the fuel tank.  Stebel on the right,  Fiamm Freeway blaster on the left, ('08-no glove box there).  Stainless button head bolts w/fender washers and nylock nuts.  And no, they are not heavy enough to sag those panels.
However, I realize most of you won't want holes in that panel with stainless heads visible there. :(
There are plenty of better methods and locations but I saw space there and went for it. ::)
Just thought of this...when I finally get around to INSTALLING the Canyon Cages I might have to move the horns...don't know, hope not.

Love to see pics...I may do that.  I actually have black pan heads that will be almost invisible.
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Offline Flat-spot

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #39 on: January 11, 2015, 08:32:05 am »
Mark,  I went to the garage and tried, but couldn't even get my phone into a position that would show you much at all.  The next time I have those panels off I'll try to remember to take some photos.
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Offline RideBellChain

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #40 on: January 12, 2015, 05:56:38 am »
 :beerchug:
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Offline Gumby

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #41 on: February 09, 2015, 12:46:39 am »
Finally put the horn on today, and this thread was a ton of help.

Thanks everyone.....

Offline bikrpitts

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #42 on: February 22, 2015, 12:05:50 pm »
Last year I bough a new left over 2013 C14 and like all of you have mentioned, it came with an anemic sounding horn so I went out and purchased the $35 Wolo Bad Boy but soon discovered there isn't a lot of room under either the left or right side covers.  After about thirty minutes surveying what room I did have, I decided to cut down a piece of angled metal I had, drill two mounting holes and use that as a mounting bracket.  I removed one of the upper engine brackets and bolted one end of the bracket to it and them simply mounted the horn to the remaining hole.  It's a tight fit but the horn is slightly visible through the left side of the lower cowl and provides excellent sound through the side vents. 

Offline Big-Al

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #43 on: February 22, 2015, 02:09:00 pm »
Last year I bough a new left over 2013 C14 and like all of you have mentioned, it came with an anemic sounding horn so I went out and purchased the $35 Wolo Bad Boy but soon discovered there isn't a lot of room under either the left or right side covers.  After about thirty minutes surveying what room I did have, I decided to cut down a piece of angled metal I had, drill two mounting holes and use that as a mounting bracket.  I removed one of the upper engine brackets and bolted one end of the bracket to it and them simply mounted the horn to the remaining hole.  It's a tight fit but the horn is slightly visible through the left side of the lower cowl and provides excellent sound through the side vents.

Same place I had mine until my Canyon Cage install forced me to move it.
2012 Kawasaki Concours (Arabian Red) (1400cc)
2008 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
2004 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
1998 BMW K1200RS (1200cc)
1991 BMW K1 (1000cc)
1986 BMW K100 LT (1000cc)
1980 BMW R100 RT (1000cc)
1975 BMW R90/6 (900cc)
1972 BSA Lightning (750cc)
1970 Norton Commando (750cc)
1969 Triumph Bonneville (650cc)
1968 Harley Davidson Sprint (250cc)
1967 Honda Super Hawk (305cc)
1967 Honda Cub (65cc)

Offline bikrpitts

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #44 on: February 22, 2015, 02:17:20 pm »
I was thinking about a purchase for the cage and wondered if I could make it all fit.

Was the bolt to short ?

Offline Big-Al

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #45 on: February 22, 2015, 03:20:10 pm »
I was thinking about a purchase for the cage and wondered if I could make it all fit.

Was the bolt to short ?

Bolt length wasn't the problem. With all the modification needed to have the horn fit in (or near) the same location after CC install, it was far easier to move the horn. It is actually better (louder) in its new location (compressor next to Rostra actuator at top right, horn in factory location). Obviously, I had to split the Wolo to accomplish this.
2012 Kawasaki Concours (Arabian Red) (1400cc)
2008 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
2004 BMW K1200GT (1200cc)
1998 BMW K1200RS (1200cc)
1991 BMW K1 (1000cc)
1986 BMW K100 LT (1000cc)
1980 BMW R100 RT (1000cc)
1975 BMW R90/6 (900cc)
1972 BSA Lightning (750cc)
1970 Norton Commando (750cc)
1969 Triumph Bonneville (650cc)
1968 Harley Davidson Sprint (250cc)
1967 Honda Super Hawk (305cc)
1967 Honda Cub (65cc)

Offline BBroj

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #46 on: May 11, 2015, 12:48:49 am »
Found this using the "search", and it has been very helpful as I just bought the Wolo "Bad Boy" horns from H.F.. For anyone using the stock mounting location for just the trumpet portion, I plan to split the unit and mount compressor and trumpet separately, is the clearance sufficient and what did you use on the trumpet to mount to? If someone had a pic, sorry but I must have missed it. The trumpet portion of mine has no mounting location, just the semi-cylindrical plastic that wrapped around the compressor, I was going to Dremmel that off.
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Offline Ninja

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #47 on: May 11, 2015, 06:31:35 pm »
Air horns like the stebel are nice but a bit slow to react once you hit the button. On my Multistrada I piggy backed the stebel to the original horn. now I have both a different tones and the OEM horn is instant and then after a slight pause the Stebel kicks in, man does it wake up the neighbors.  :-\
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Offline Walker18

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #48 on: May 11, 2015, 08:30:00 pm »
I have the Banshee horn, also modulates the hi/low beams when the horn is going off. The stock horns are first to energize,
1/2 sec later the Banshee starts up and modulating lights. I mounted it on the top right, in front of my Fuzeblock.

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Offline Flat-spot

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Re: yet another horn upgrade/install
« Reply #49 on: May 11, 2015, 08:46:47 pm »
Air horns like the stebel are nice but a bit slow to react once you hit the button. On my Multistrada I piggy backed the stebel to the original horn. now I have both a different tones and the OEM horn is instant and then after a slight pause the Stebel kicks in, man does it wake up the neighbors.  :-\


If the Stebel is wired and fused direct to battery with appropriate heavy wire and relay,  there is NO delay and it's louder.  The circuit through the original horn is not nearly heavy enough.
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