Author Topic: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic  (Read 967 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline MrPepsi

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 758
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« on: July 12, 2018, 03:03:54 pm »
Hello fellow riders. I have a 2009, with 74,000 miles which is running perfectly. However it has been some time since I had the valves checked, and I have a big trip coming up so I wanted to double check the valves. I took it to the dealer, they checked the valves, changed the valve cover gasket and they also replaced the spark plugs while they were in there. All valves were within spec and the bike is still running perfect. On my way home from the dealer yesterday, the bike performed fine on the freeway, but once I was in the city in stop and go traffic, the temp gauge seemed to remain at the top of the scale, and the fan pretty much ran the entire time. It was quite hot when I started the ride, somewhere around 90, but by the time I got to the city, it was only around 62. I could smell antifreeze at each stoplight.

This morning I made sure to ride again, and the entire ride it was around 58-60 out. Freeway riding of course was normal, but at every stop once I got off the freeway, the temp would spike and the fan would run. Once moving on the city streets the gauge would go down two notches from the top. I could smell antifreeze not at every stop, but a few of the stops.

Could it be it's just time to flush the radiator? Could it be I need a new thermostat, does it have one? Is it likely this was somehow caused by the work done at the dealer? Seems unlikely, but the timing is too much of a hint. What am I not thinking of?
« Last Edit: July 12, 2018, 06:38:58 pm by MrPepsi »
Brent Johnson 
Why MrPepsi? I collect and consume Pepsi!
2009 C-14 "Razzi"
2013 SFO to PDX Loop Ride Trip Report

Offline kv5e

  • Roll miles, Keep smiles
  • Moderator
  • Crotch Rocket
  • **
  • Posts: 1295
  • TARKUS - Texas Bad Boy
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 5063
  • Membership Level: Area Director
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2018, 03:11:56 pm »
Coolant change time IMHO. Evaluate after that.

All Fluids every 30000 is not a bad idea.

Offline MrPepsi

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 758
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2018, 03:13:49 pm »
How much Tupperware removal is required for a coolant flush?
Brent Johnson 
Why MrPepsi? I collect and consume Pepsi!
2009 C-14 "Razzi"
2013 SFO to PDX Loop Ride Trip Report

Offline Daytona_Mike

  • Sport Tourer
  • *****
  • Posts: 2285
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2018, 03:26:02 pm »
Brent, You are  telling us that your valves have never been touched or  adjusted- not one valve - ever - in 74k miles.  I find that to be unheard of and very rare.
What does the shim map say that you had them do for you?  How tight are they. Mine were tight at 24k with a couple out of spec tight.
  'Within spec' can mean it was in spec  when checked  and now-today- they are no longer  in spec. 

For anyone else reading this please:
1) Always get a shim map done so you can track each valve and how they are changing and what was done to each valve.
2) Never have your valves 'checked'.  If your going  to pay someone  or you are going  into the engine that far always (withing reason of course) try and move all the valves to the maximum spec. In this way you will maintain at least a minimum gap much longer  and it   will last longer between adjustments. All valves on these bikes  always  migrate towards minimum  specs (unless there is some rare -and it is rare- mechanical defect.)

I dont think it was anything the dealer did to make the bike run hotter.

Good reading here:
http://forum.cog-online.org/concours-14-zg1400-general-chat-and-tech/valve-adjustment-c14/
« Last Edit: July 12, 2018, 03:30:41 pm by Daytona_Mike »
Normally aspirated engines have perpetual turbo lag
2000 Red C10 1052 kit
2008  C14 Silver Dammit Full AreaP- Flies are put back in SISF_Flash
2011  KLR650   688 piston ported and polished
2011  KTM 530    This thing is FUN!!

Offline Guest

  • Bicycle
  • *
  • Posts: 103
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2018, 03:54:21 pm »
All valves were within spec (and have been every time since new)
riiiiiiiiiiiiiight.   :popcorncouple:

Offline MrPepsi

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 758
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2018, 03:58:01 pm »
Not sure what you mean. I have had the valves checked regularly and they have never needed adjusting.
I'm certainly not a corner carver but my chicken strips aren't too big.
Brent Johnson 
Why MrPepsi? I collect and consume Pepsi!
2009 C-14 "Razzi"
2013 SFO to PDX Loop Ride Trip Report

Offline Guest

  • Bicycle
  • *
  • Posts: 103
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2018, 04:43:01 pm »
Not sure what you mean. I have had the valves checked regularly and they have never needed adjusting.
I'm certainly not a corner carver but my chicken strips aren't too big.
Just an observation that the people who trust dealers to do their valve adjustments often report that the dealer claims the valves are always in spec...  Yet those of us who check the valves ourselves find, more often than not, that the valves are NOT in spec.

I find it highly unlikely that a C14 has made it 74k miles without a single valve tightening up.

But that isn't why your started the thread...  So sorry for taking it offtrack.

:threadjack:

Back to your regularly scheduled programming...

Offline MrPepsi

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 758
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2018, 04:47:10 pm »
This is the first time this dealer has checked the valves, and I've had them checked by someone I trust very much three times prior to this. Also, I don't think I'm the only one who has had this result. While I agree it is unlikely, I trust the other shop that checked them completely. This dealer has not earned my trust yet, but I believe they are in spec because they have been for so long.
Brent Johnson 
Why MrPepsi? I collect and consume Pepsi!
2009 C-14 "Razzi"
2013 SFO to PDX Loop Ride Trip Report

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 8260
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 5977
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2018, 05:54:55 pm »
having someone do your services, and placing trust they know and truely are attending to the spec, is placing you in a tight spot.
As all the others that commented, I simply cannot believe, or accept, that at 74k miles none whatsoever needed a new shim.
Without seeing the clearances, sticking a feeler gage in under a cam, and knowing it fit or DIDN't, and saying it's "in spec", is like saying "sounds great".

as for the recent notice of the temp gauge, I think it's time for the complete coolant flush, should have been done during the time when all the plastic was just off, as the upper fright fairing, left mid fairing were off, and the coolant jug could have been drained/removed, flushed out, along with access to the water pump drain bolt, and radiator filler cap...flushing the system with clean water, and if needed an accommodating "cooling sytem flushing agent", twice each, or even three times, before refilling with coolant. along with this, inspecting all those hoses for deterioration...

it's highly unlikely anything was 'done" by the mechanic, to create "more heat", and also asking if replacing the thermostat will help, prior to flushing the system, would be a wasted effort in parts and time, at this point, unless you know the coolant is all fresh and good.

« Last Edit: July 12, 2018, 05:58:54 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW
and if you are gonna call me names... it's MR. Analdweeb if you please...

Offline MrPepsi

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 758
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2018, 06:06:49 pm »
Ok, enough. I'm sorry for bringing up the fact that I feel the bike has been in spec for 74,000 miles. Pretend I never mentioned it, in fact just forget the whole thing. Tired of trying to defend what I feel to be true.
Brent Johnson 
Why MrPepsi? I collect and consume Pepsi!
2009 C-14 "Razzi"
2013 SFO to PDX Loop Ride Trip Report

Offline TimR

  • Global Moderator
  • Iron Butt
  • **
  • Posts: 3544
  • AREA: Northwest Area
  • COG#: 9032
  • Membership Level: Asst. Area Director
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2018, 06:49:46 pm »
The question that comes to my mind is did a fan get disconnected when they were doing the valve check?
Blue 1975 Z1B 900, Red 09 C14     I might not be perfect but at least I don't ride a Suzuki

Offline MrPepsi

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 758
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2018, 06:53:44 pm »
The fan was kicking on, and running nearly the entire time while in stop and go traffic.
Brent Johnson 
Why MrPepsi? I collect and consume Pepsi!
2009 C-14 "Razzi"
2013 SFO to PDX Loop Ride Trip Report

Offline Boomer

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1028
  • Me dwarfing Vivian
    • Boomers GTR Site
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #12 on: July 12, 2018, 07:12:19 pm »
There are 2 fans. if one of them is diconnected the other will still run, but the bike will run exactly like you are experiencing.
George "Boomer" Garratt
Wickford, UK
CDA-007


Offline MrPepsi

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 758
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #13 on: July 12, 2018, 07:20:07 pm »
Very good info. Thanks Boomer
Brent Johnson 
Why MrPepsi? I collect and consume Pepsi!
2009 C-14 "Razzi"
2013 SFO to PDX Loop Ride Trip Report

Offline oldnslo_MO

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 277
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 9924
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #14 on: July 12, 2018, 07:24:26 pm »
Ok, enough. I'm sorry for bringing up the fact that I feel the bike has been in spec for 74,000 miles. Pretend I never mentioned it, in fact just forget the whole thing. Tired of trying to defend what I feel to be true.
don't worry about all the so called experts , i had an 09 that did not need any adjusting until 80k, and i checked them all myself so i know. i also kept a shim map each time to track any trends.as long as they are within the tolerance in the factory manual there is no need to change..that includes the plus or minus given in the manual.. maintaing to the exact middle spec is a waste of time..hang in there and ignore the naysayers and dweebs.... :great:
« Last Edit: July 12, 2018, 09:37:26 pm by Gumby »
happy trails  2016 concours14,2010 bmw k1300ggt, 2015 bmw r1200rt, 09 concours14, 75 kawasaki H1   500cc*79 triumph bonneville750* 2 each  82su zuki gs1100e* 05 yamaha fz1 1100* 03 yamaha fz1 1100*01 goldwing 1800*97 goldwing 1500* 93 goldwing 1500* 80 kawasaki vulcan 1500*76 kawasaki kz650* 66 triumph Bonneville 650* 68 triumph tr 650* 72 norton commando750* 70 bsa rocket III 750*  68 hon cb350* 66 hon cb305*1960 BSA golden flash 500cc*1950 cushman

Offline MrPepsi

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 758
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #15 on: July 12, 2018, 07:35:02 pm »
Yes I received the same tolerance spec sheet from the last shop I took her to.
They were never dead center, but they were within the range.
Brent Johnson 
Why MrPepsi? I collect and consume Pepsi!
2009 C-14 "Razzi"
2013 SFO to PDX Loop Ride Trip Report

Offline Old Man on a Connie

  • South West Area Director
  • Officer
  • Iron Butt
  • ****
  • Posts: 4917
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: 9932
  • Membership Level: Area Director
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #16 on: July 12, 2018, 09:19:40 pm »
I agree with Tim and George. I think the fans are staged also. 1 comes on at X temp and both fire at X temp. 1st thing I'd check and easiest. Check the burp bottle too and make sure it's at the top line when cold. Keep us posted.
"I don't always ride street bikes, but when I do, It's a Concours. A C14 '11 silver to be precise." OTP 2017 Traveler. It was a Blast Baby.

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 8260
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 5977
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #17 on: July 12, 2018, 09:22:20 pm »
Ok, enough. I'm sorry for bringing up the fact that I feel the bike has been in spec for 74,000 miles. Pretend I never mentioned it, in fact just forget the whole thing. Tired of trying to defend what I feel to be true.

I appoligise if you took my comment, (above the others that commented the same...) as something condescending, or malicious in any way. I was just surprised to hear 'everything is within spec'...

and being an "anal dweeb" ( thanks, nice comment...O&S...),
you can refer to me as MISTER Anal Dweeb, if it makes you feel better.
 :rotflmao: :nananana: :rotflmao: ::)
erring on the side of caution, and accuracy, is not an option in my book, so sorry...
When I inspect clearances, I take into consideration the range, and it's only a .002" zone... so when I inspect using inch feeler stock, and find one down at the .0001"-.0002" from the bottom end of the range, I say it isn't in the range... period.. I don't use metric feelers, from Auotozone, Or WalMart, and hope they have one in the "range" in the set of .XXmm...

as for Boomer's comment, I wasn't thinking about that, but it has popped up... and he has a point... check the fan plugs, and dual operation while your looking.

sorry if you took it wrongly.


30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW
and if you are gonna call me names... it's MR. Analdweeb if you please...

Offline MrPepsi

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 758
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #18 on: July 12, 2018, 10:12:03 pm »
I also posted on the "other" site and this was a culmination from both. I'm fine, and thank you.

However on the ride home I ended up with coolant down the side of the bike. Both fans are running. I called the dealer and they said they would make it right. I'll be taking it in on Wednesday, and it will stay parked until then.
Brent Johnson 
Why MrPepsi? I collect and consume Pepsi!
2009 C-14 "Razzi"
2013 SFO to PDX Loop Ride Trip Report

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 8260
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 5977
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #19 on: July 12, 2018, 10:15:14 pm »
 :great: :great:

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW
and if you are gonna call me names... it's MR. Analdweeb if you please...

Offline Red Fox

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 692
  • AREA: Northwest Area
  • COG#: 11691
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #20 on: July 12, 2018, 10:19:07 pm »
On my way home from the dealer yesterday, the bike performed fine on the freeway, but once I was in the city in stop and go traffic, the temp gauge seemed to remain at the top of the scale, and the fan pretty much ran the entire time. It was quite hot when I started the ride, somewhere around 90, but by the time I got to the city, it was only around 62. I could smell antifreeze at each stoplight.

This morning I made sure to ride again, and the entire ride it was around 58-60 out. Freeway riding of course was normal, but at every stop once I got off the freeway, the temp would spike and the fan would run. Once moving on the city streets the gauge would go down two notches from the top. I could smell antifreeze not at every stop, but a few of the stops.

Could it be it's just time to take it back to the dealer for their service warranty? 


Fixed it for you.  You paid for the work; get it done right.
TryCities, WA.    2011  C-14, silver; 53,000 miles.

Offline oldnslo_MO

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 277
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 9924
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #21 on: July 13, 2018, 05:02:10 pm »
I agree with Tim and George. I think the fans are staged also. 1 comes on at X temp and both fire at X temp. 1st thing I'd check and easiest. Check the burp bottle too and make sure it's at the top line when cold. Keep us posted.
according to the factory repair manual, page 17-66 there is only one fan relay and it runs both fans  together. there is no staging. if one runs they both run. maybe you should invest in a kawasaki repair manual and read it before giving incorrect info...IMHO... :dink: :P :character0029:
happy trails  2016 concours14,2010 bmw k1300ggt, 2015 bmw r1200rt, 09 concours14, 75 kawasaki H1   500cc*79 triumph bonneville750* 2 each  82su zuki gs1100e* 05 yamaha fz1 1100* 03 yamaha fz1 1100*01 goldwing 1800*97 goldwing 1500* 93 goldwing 1500* 80 kawasaki vulcan 1500*76 kawasaki kz650* 66 triumph Bonneville 650* 68 triumph tr 650* 72 norton commando750* 70 bsa rocket III 750*  68 hon cb350* 66 hon cb305*1960 BSA golden flash 500cc*1950 cushman

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 8260
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 5977
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #22 on: July 13, 2018, 05:28:22 pm »
There are 2 fans. if one of them is disconnected the other will still run, but the bike will run exactly like you are experiencing.


 ;)

when I mentioned Boomer's comment having merit, it is because within the last 2-3 months, I recall someone actually had that happen, ( I looked back in time here, so it must have been on the 'other' forum where it popped up) following...... a valve adjust........ they missed re connecting one of the two fan connections, when they rotated the radiator forward for additional clearance during the adjust.

yes, they both run simultaniously, and come on and go off as a pair.... as long as they are BOTH plugged in. :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

and at least one had that "special single fan" right from the factory...
http://forum.cog-online.org/concours-14-zg1400-general-chat-and-tech/radiator-cooling-fans/msg224772/#msg224772

 :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :-\ :-[
« Last Edit: July 13, 2018, 05:46:31 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW
and if you are gonna call me names... it's MR. Analdweeb if you please...

Offline Old Man on a Connie

  • South West Area Director
  • Officer
  • Iron Butt
  • ****
  • Posts: 4917
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: 9932
  • Membership Level: Area Director
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2018, 10:59:37 pm »
I agree with Tim and George. I think the fans are staged also. 1 comes on at X temp and both fire at X temp. 1st thing I'd check and easiest. Check the burp bottle too and make sure it's at the top line when cold. Keep us posted.
according to the factory repair manual, page 17-66 there is only one fan relay and it runs both fans  together. there is no staging. if one runs they both run. maybe you should invest in a kawasaki repair manual and read it before giving incorrect info...IMHO... :dink: :P :character0029:
What love from the popcorn section. Geez. You must have missed the caveat "I Think". If it was stated as fact it would have read "I Know". Guess I'm standing on the wrong side of the counter at the shooting gallery. But then I also prefer the 55 profile on the rear. Sheesh. Or maybe I just misread it. Best of luck Mr. P. Let me know and I can send you my copy of the factory service manual to use.
"I don't always ride street bikes, but when I do, It's a Concours. A C14 '11 silver to be precise." OTP 2017 Traveler. It was a Blast Baby.

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 8260
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 5977
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: Bike recently serviced, now getting hotter in traffic
« Reply #24 on: July 13, 2018, 11:25:38 pm »
 :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :nananana: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:all these damned old people get sooo curmudgeonly at times...
don't they Old Man...

I'd send him a copy, but the file is tooooooo beeeeeeeeeg...
 :rotflmao: :truce:

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW
and if you are gonna call me names... it's MR. Analdweeb if you please...