Author Topic: Cutting a new stove key  (Read 981 times)

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Offline Turbo Ghost

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Cutting a new stove key
« on: August 29, 2017, 01:39:03 pm »
I did a search but, everything I found basically said get a locksmith to make a new key.  My problem is the original key is bent and difficult to remove and I'm afraid it will break at some point and be stuck forever in there so, I ordered a new key and took it to my local locksmith and it wouldn't fit in the cutting machine.  It's the old style with the clamp, cutter and follower.  Not the kind that uses cardboard-backed blanks.  So, my question is where and/or how are you guys getting your keys cut?  Does it require a particular type of cutter? 

Offline COGnosticator

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2017, 02:20:22 pm »
My locksmith used the small key in the small key fob, well not really a fob but the emergency fob thing.
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Offline Turbo Ghost

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2017, 04:57:15 pm »
Sorry!  I should have clarified a bit more!  He was using the key you mentioned as the one to copy but, the stove knob key was the one that wouldn't fit in the machine so, he couldn't cut a new one.

Offline CW

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2017, 12:25:43 pm »
I did a search but, everything I found basically said get a locksmith to make a new key.  My problem is the original key is bent and difficult to remove and I'm afraid it will break at some point and be stuck forever in there so, I ordered a new key and took it to my local locksmith and it wouldn't fit in the cutting machine.  It's the old style with the clamp, cutter and follower.  Not the kind that uses cardboard-backed blanks.  So, my question is where and/or how are you guys getting your keys cut?  Does it require a particular type of cutter?

My advice would be to do what I did: leave the stove knob key right where it is, in the switch, for ever and ever, never to be removed. Make a new, separate key to be used for the gas hole, seat, and bags. A Smith can cut this new key using your emergency fob key as a pattern. It will fit into his key cutter. Then cut down the new key, and JB Weld it into a radio knob, and store it in the seat lock hole. Nobody will ever notice it.

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Offline Turbo Ghost

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2017, 11:15:13 am »
I would do that but, the original key is looking fatigued where it's bent and I'm really afraid it's going to break off in the switch.  That's the reason I wanted a new key.  I have spare keys for the fuel and luggage already.  I'm just stressing over the ignition key.  Thanks to several bills hitting me at once I've been broke so I haven't been able to try any other locksmiths yet but, soon.

Offline Derek

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2017, 11:23:29 am »
Have you thought about the dealer?  Obviously not the cheapest option but they could order a blank stove key and any decent dealer will have a source to cut it... or at least someone they can send you to. 
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2017, 06:11:59 pm »
Have you thought about the dealer?  Obviously not the cheapest option but they could order a blank stove key and any decent dealer will have a source to cut it... or at least someone they can send you to.

I don't think you are getting what the o/p really is trying to say....
He wants to replace the key with the knob end... and because of the knob end, there is no place to clamp the key into the cutting machine... get it?

I've not taken the knob apart, but I do know it can be disassembled, its held together with a roll pin, pushed in from the side... inside the plasti housing is a rafcheting mechanism, to prevent damage to the key if forced during an attempt at theft, or tampering with the lock...
Not sure if that roll pin extends into and thru the metal key shank or not...if it does, maybe pulling it out would allow the metal key blade to be pulled out from the knob base.....
I know someone did actually pull one apart about 5 years ago, and shot photos, can't remember who it was tho.... maybe Matt?

Anyway, finding a drill bit and tap combo that would be close to the inside diameter of that roll pin, drilling and tapping it, and inserting a screw to be used for pulling that pin out (iirc its a blind hole, doesn't go all the way thru) you can see the innerds, and possibly pull that blade out... just tossing that out for experimentation.

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Offline Turbo Ghost

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2017, 06:54:58 pm »
You are correct on the roll pins being blind.  Your suggestion is what the locksmith had suggested but, I was hoping for a less potentially destructive method.  I ordered my key from the local dealer and went to the first of two suggested locksmiths but, haven't been able to get to the other to see if they could help.  I "may" be able to do that today.  Here's hoping!

Offline Deepsea

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2017, 07:46:04 pm »
I was at my local Ace Hardware and found the blanks for both the A and B keys. The a key is an Ilco X258 listed as Kawasaki. The B key was an Ilco YH47 listed as Yamaha. The B key is slightly longer but that was not a problem for them to match and cut.
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Offline Turbo Ghost

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2017, 03:16:28 am »
I was at my local Ace Hardware and found the blanks for both the A and B keys. The a key is an Ilco X258 listed as Kawasaki. The B key was an Ilco YH47 listed as Yamaha. The B key is slightly longer but that was not a problem for them to match and cut.

I looked that key up and it's just a regular key.  I need the ignition stove knob key cut and it won't fit in the cutter.  I went to another locksmith today but, he was out on call.  I'll have to try next week.

Offline Deepsea

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2017, 04:16:46 am »
If your stove knob key will open your gas tank it will use the same blank. Do you still have the key that came in the FOB? You can use that as the pattern. If it's the stove knob part you need, well I wish you good luck. You might be able to disassemble it. Not sure I'd try unless I was desperate.
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Offline Turbo Ghost

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2017, 07:34:33 pm »
If it's the stove knob part you need,

I'll try to clarify this again since only one person seems to have grasped what I need.  I HAVE a new stove knob blank.  I need that blank cut so I can replace my original stove knob which is bent badly and sticking.  The stove knob blank does not fit in a normal key cutting machine because the knob is too big.  I was asking how someone got their stove knob key blank cut and if it's possible to do it without disassembling it which is seeming less likely now. 

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2017, 07:52:27 pm »
At this point, about your only recourse is to disassemble the original knob, as I noted, and see if the blade can be removed once that roll pin is out...
You don't have much choice other than that, and if it does work, then you know how to disassemble the new replacement one for cutting..

I understood your dilemma right from the start, sorry you have to go thru this, I have been on the pulse of this bike since 7/07 and this is actually the first request for a new knob key to be cut.
Just be careful, and follow what I noted to pull that pin, also when you take it apart, shoot a photo or two of what it looks like, before disassembling the internal mechanism... so you know how it goes back together... I have to believe that blade is replaceable, once the knob is taken apart, and it may be pinned in place internally, or by some other means held captive, as they had to cut that blade to make it from the start...

Best of luck,

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Offline rcannon409

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2017, 10:44:01 pm »
Did you go to a real locksmith store?  I've had two stove tops cut here:

Bobs Lock Shop, West Valley city, ut  I know the cost to cut them both was way under 20.00. I think it was 7.00, each...very reasonable.

http://bobslockshop.com/?device=desktop

Offline CW

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2017, 12:23:32 am »
I know I'm dense, but can somebody explain to me how the stove knob key can get stuck if it is inserted into the ignition lock, never, ever to be removed.

Seems to me that in order for a key to be "stuck", you would have to first try to remove it.
If sticking is a risk, then don't ever remove it.

What am I missing?
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Offline Turbo Ghost

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2017, 09:22:12 am »
Did you go to a real locksmith store?  I've had two stove tops cut here:

Bobs Lock Shop, West Valley city, ut  I know the cost to cut them both was way under 20.00. I think it was 7.00, each...very reasonable.

http://bobslockshop.com/?device=desktop


Yes, it was an actual locksmith shop that I've been using for years but, the stove knob just wouldn't allow the blank to fit properly into the cutter.  Did your locksmith use the standard cutter or did he use a pistol cutter?

Offline Turbo Ghost

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2017, 09:24:55 am »
At this point, about your only recourse is to disassemble the original knob, as I noted, and see if the blade can be removed once that roll pin is out...and it may be pinned in place internally, or by some other means held captive, as they had to cut that blade to make it from the start...

Best of luck,

There are two blind roll pins.  It appears one holds the blank in the mechanism and the other holds the mechanism in the body of the knob.  I want to try this other locksmith before I disassemble it.  I don't want to end up with a loose knob or possibly have some mysterious internal part go flying never to be seen again!

Offline Turbo Ghost

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2017, 09:31:57 am »
I know I'm dense, but can somebody explain to me how the stove knob key can get stuck if it is inserted into the ignition lock, never, ever to be removed.

Seems to me that in order for a key to be "stuck", you would have to first try to remove it.
If sticking is a risk, then don't ever remove it.

What am I missing?

At some point in this bike's past, someone tried to force the key and it is badly bent where the radius of the cut section of the key meets the body of the blade.  It causes the key to not want to turn easily.  I've tried using the spare key and it turns fine with it.  The bend in the stove knob key prevents the key from fully seating into the ignition so it's not fully engaging the pins.  This is the sticking I'm referring to although, it is difficult to remove as well.  The bend in the key is severe enough to show signs of fatigue at the bend and I'm worried it will eventually break off leaving me with no way to turn the key anymore.  Also, with the poor engagement I'm sure over time it will wear the pins and internals of the ignition more rapidly.  Does that clear things up?

Offline rcannon409

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2017, 12:17:31 pm »
Did you go to a real locksmith store?  I've had two stove tops cut here:

Bobs Lock Shop, West Valley city, ut  I know the cost to cut them both was way under 20.00. I think it was 7.00, each...very reasonable.

http://bobslockshop.com/?device=desktop


Yes, it was an actual locksmith shop that I've been using for years but, the stove knob just wouldn't allow the blank to fit properly into the cutter.  Did your locksmith use the standard cutter or did he use a pistol cutter?



Im not sure what  he used. I handed him the new stovetop and the old one. He disappeared into the work area.  No way to see what specific machine he was using.

Its the premier lock shop here in the valley.  Ive never had to take a key back to them for a touch up.  Their keys just work. 


Offline CW

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2017, 12:32:11 pm »
I know I'm dense, but can somebody explain to me how the stove knob key can get stuck if it is inserted into the ignition lock, never, ever to be removed.

Seems to me that in order for a key to be "stuck", you would have to first try to remove it.
If sticking is a risk, then don't ever remove it.

What am I missing?

At some point in this bike's past, someone tried to force the key and it is badly bent where the radius of the cut section of the key meets the body of the blade.  It causes the key to not want to turn easily.  I've tried using the spare key and it turns fine with it.  The bend in the stove knob key prevents the key from fully seating into the ignition so it's not fully engaging the pins.  This is the sticking I'm referring to although, it is difficult to remove as well.  The bend in the key is severe enough to show signs of fatigue at the bend and I'm worried it will eventually break off leaving me with no way to turn the key anymore.  Also, with the poor engagement I'm sure over time it will wear the pins and internals of the ignition more rapidly.  Does that clear things up?

Yes, thank you! Sorry to be so dense. Good luck, and ride safely.🏍
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Offline rcannon409

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #20 on: September 11, 2017, 12:39:44 pm »
By the way, I wonder where they source the metal from when they are making motorcycle KEYS?

A good gust of wind will bend the stock key kawasaki supplied with my ninja 1000.  I wonder if anyone makes a key blank made from better base material?

Offline Turbo Ghost

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Re: Cutting a new stove key
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2017, 09:44:14 am »
I've actually always been amazed at how strong keys are (not necessarily Kaw keys but, keys in general).  The number of times they get twisted and forced over the life of a car or door without failing is impressive!  Of course, it appears our keys aren't quite up to the same standard as an average car!