Author Topic: First time valve adjustment complete  (Read 1585 times)

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Offline JOHN

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First time valve adjustment complete
« on: January 31, 2018, 03:15:24 am »
2008 C14 70,500 miles. Bought bike 2 years ago, it had 43k then. Prev owner said he got it used and was told valves had been done at 32k. I did lots of research, bought Fred's DVD's and decided to tackle the job.
A big Thank You to all forum members posts on their valve adjustment. I got a lot of great info from this forum.
As I was taking fairing stays, brackets off I noticed how everything looked a little too perfect, like it had never been apart before now.
 Started suspecting valves never been checked. Continued, checked clearances, all 16 we're way tight. Felt like a kick in the gut. But bike has always ran great, no issues. So I didn't get into panic mode. Did the math, swapped some shims, ordered individual shims that I needed, finished with all in spec. Started bike today, throttle body sync tomorrow.
Learned a lot about my bike, and it wasn't nearly as bad a job as some might think. Just take your time and be super careful, double check all your work.
If you get a used bike and aren't 100 percent sure valves have been checked you gotta get in there and see for yourself. I wish I would have checked sooner. 70k miles and possibly first time done.

Offline Freddy

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2018, 03:24:53 am »
All 16 'way tight' eh - that's a first.  Glad you had no dramas.
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Offline gsun

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2018, 03:35:32 am »
15 of 16 of mine were out at 25K. Not a first.

Offline Freddy

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2018, 05:48:54 am »
That's also unusual from what I've read on here over the years.  While 'out' and 'way tight' aren't technical terms, I suppose they have more significance to the owners. 
The best substitute for brains is ..............what?

Offline C. Moore

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2018, 10:51:15 am »
You're probably right about the valves never being checked on your bike. Some owners never check the valves so it always interests me to see what's discovered on a higher mileage bike when the cams come out for the first time. Sounds like you are doing things right. Fred's videos were a huge help for me along with the advice from everyone here.
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Offline Slambo

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2018, 11:36:27 am »
Nice job John!  Did mine myself couple months ago...found 10 of 16 out of spec tight at 18,xxx miles.  I gave same advice...take your time, take lots of pictures and triple check everything...
Scott
 
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Offline jwh20

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2018, 12:18:55 pm »
On the 2010 ABS and 2011+ bikes, the LH sub-frame bracket is a sure-fire way to tell if the top of the engine has been accessed or not.  It's IMPOSSIBLE to get the ABS line cushion that runs through it out without leaving some evidence.  Since you must remove that bracket to remove the valve cover, it's a good way to tell.

That, of course, as well as the general look of things.  There is nearly always evidence of things being removed and reassembled.
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Offline JOHN

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2018, 12:53:34 pm »
I said "way tight", maybe a little too dramatic. Anyway, here's the measurements before changing shims. All 16 tight.
Exhaust spec .19 - .24mm
Intake spec    .12 - .17mm

Exhaust -  .13 .15     .15 .15    .15 .13    .10 .13

Intake -     .10 .13    .10 .13    .13 .10    .10 .09   

Offline jwh20

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2018, 01:12:55 pm »
I'd call the exhaust side "way tight" too!  The intake side is less of a concern but a too-tight exhaust valve is more prone to burning since the needed contact with the valve seat for heat transfer decreases with tightness of the clearance.  Where is the threshold for damage?  It's hard to say since it depends on many factors but the tighter it is the more the risk.
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Offline oldnslo_MO

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2018, 04:26:15 pm »
on my 09, did valves @ 20,40,60,and 80k.. all in spec til 80k had to shim 3 exhaust valves, guess i'm just lucky   ;)
happy trails  2016 concours14,2010 bmw k1300ggt, 2015 bmw r1200rt, 09 concours14, 75 kawasaki H1   500cc*79 triumph bonneville750* 2 each  82su zuki gs1100e* 05 yamaha fz1 1100* 03 yamaha fz1 1100*01 goldwing 1800*97 goldwing 1500* 93 goldwing 1500* 80 kawasaki vulcan 1500*76 kawasaki kz650* 66 triumph Bonneville 650* 68 triumph tr 650* 72 norton commando750* 70 bsa rocket III 750*  68 hon cb350* 66 hon cb305*1960 BSA golden flash 500cc*1950 cushman

Offline hlh1

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2018, 04:35:13 pm »
I said "way tight", maybe a little too dramatic. Anyway, here's the measurements before changing shims. All 16 tight.
Exhaust spec .19 - .24mm
Intake spec    .12 - .17mm

Exhaust -  .13 .15     .15 .15    .15 .13    .10 .13

Intake -     .10 .13    .10 .13    .13 .10    .10 .09   

This doesn't seem too bad for 70k miles?
06 WeeStrom, 09 C14 ABS, 83 GS1100ED,


Offline LinuxGuyGary

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2018, 08:03:59 pm »
Just doing mine now, @ 18,400 miles.

Exh: .0075 ~ .0094
Int:  .0047 ~ .0067



Exh: .005 .006      .007 .006      .006 .006      .006 .006
Int:  .005 .005      .005 .004      .003 .004      .005 .005


Shims are ordered, i'm changing everything to get them to the loose side of the range.  Sadly not a single shim could be reused  >:(   
Compared to the work to get here, the shim cost is minimal.

I will breathe a nice big sigh of relief when its all back together and going .

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Offline SilverConnieRider

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2018, 09:09:18 pm »
Quote
Prev owner said he got it used and was told valves had been done at 32k

If the PO didn't or couldn't tell you if some where tight or loose then I would assume they were never done.

Of course it could have been that the PO took it to a dealer and they never did any work and said - "They were all in spec" - that'll be $500.
That is why I would never trust anyone to do mine unless I was standing over them watching.  So I might as well do my own.
It's just too easy to not do something and then say you did, as someone could say, 10 out of 16 were tight and now all are in spec. :-[


Offline jwh20

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2018, 09:28:40 pm »
Shims are ordered, i'm changing everything to get them to the loose side of the range.  Sadly not a single shim could be reused  >:(   
Compared to the work to get here, the shim cost is minimal.

It seems to me that reusable shim sizes are few and far between.  My experience has been the same as yours.  Hopefully you ordered ProX shims from RidersDomain (formerly JakeWilson).  They show what they have in stock, ship fast, and at $1.99/shim you can't beat the prices!
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Offline LinuxGuyGary

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2018, 09:46:59 pm »
Actually I ordered from Dennis Kirk, but pricing was similar.   There were a few that I wanted half sizes for, so I got OEM Honda ones for those @ about 50% of Kawasaki prices.

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Offline jwh20

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2018, 10:06:37 pm »
Actually I ordered from Dennis Kirk, but pricing was similar.   There were a few that I wanted half sizes for, so I got OEM Honda ones for those @ about 50% of Kawasaki prices.

Hopefully they have them in stock.  The last time I ordered shims from Dennis Kirk, I placed the order and then 3 days later I got an email that they were out of stock and would be available in 2 weeks.  I ordered from RidersDomain/JakeWilson (and yes, they have the 1/2 sizes too!) and had them the next day.  Their web site shows actual stock when you order, so there are no surprises.

In my experience, none of the dealer-based mail order places stock shims.  I think it's an unwritten rule: "Never stock shims!"

Anyway, keep that in mind if Kirk eventually tells you they are back ordered.
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Offline LinuxGuyGary

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2018, 10:14:36 pm »
they have shipped with no surprises,   so I think i'm golden
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Offline gsun

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #17 on: February 01, 2018, 02:19:22 am »
That's also unusual from what I've read on here over the years.  While 'out' and 'way tight' aren't technical terms, I suppose they have more significance to the owners.

Out means out of spec. Too tight. May not be technical but not just significant to the owners. And looking at his measurements, "way out" is appropriate!

Offline Freddy

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2018, 04:44:53 am »
I wonder occasionally if some folks know what they're doin' - no-one in particular, just novices in general.   :beerchug:
The best substitute for brains is ..............what?

Offline jwh20

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #19 on: February 01, 2018, 12:50:42 pm »
That's also unusual from what I've read on here over the years.  While 'out' and 'way tight' aren't technical terms, I suppose they have more significance to the owners.

Out means out of spec. Too tight. May not be technical but not just significant to the owners. And looking at his measurements, "way out" is appropriate!

The spec is:

Quote
Exhaust spec .19 - .24mm

So if the dealer opened it up and checked and found 0.19mm he could honestly say, "in spec" since it is.  But if I were doing it, I'd adjust any valve that was at or tighter than about 0.20mm to something closer to 0.24mm.  In my experience the valves NEVER get looser, just tighter.  Any valve that is at 0.19mm is going to be out-of-spec in short order.  By the time you've done the work to get to the valves to check clearance, the extra effort and cost to adjust them is minimal. 
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Offline Buzzard

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Re: First time valve adjustment complete
« Reply #20 on: February 02, 2018, 02:27:19 pm »
I am also doing the valve check job. 12 of the 16 were tight, this with 50K miles. I am re-shimming all of them, to the larger clearances within spec. Dealer was supposed to have checked them at 20K. I'm going to guess that the mechanic who looked at the clearances decided they were close enough to spec, so he left them. When the dealer checks the valves, does the shop charge more if shim changes are made? They ought to, it is more work, and the owner would know what was done. A good shop would give the owner a list of just how the valves measured, before and after. Only in dream land, I guess. That's why I do it myself.