Author Topic: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...  (Read 837 times)

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Offline WANDRNG

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Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« on: September 06, 2017, 04:53:20 pm »
Appears my front left engine mount bolt fell out at some point.

4 closest local dealers don't have one of these $8 bolts with washer.

Parts houses I tried all say probably two weeks before the $7 bolt + washer gets here earliest. Certainly not 1 week. Can't rush it either.

Dealer says, apologetically, that they called Mama.  And Kaw HQ will expedite a bolt set (2 bolts/2washers) for $16 + $32 for two day shipping. Dealer says they'll put it in for free, yay.

Uhhhmm, ahhhh,  really. My only option to get one of the 4 bolts that holds my engine in my C14 in time for the Wild Wasatch (leaving the 13th) is pay $48. For a bolt. Well, 2 bolts, one of which I don't need.

It's a Bolt, Socket, 10x45, (part # 92153 on the Engine Mount page) can't I just go to Lowes or something.  Maybe just put a piece of bailing wire looped through the holes a couple of times. Maybe a bunch of duct tape  or some JB Weld or...  Sigh.

Sometimes wish I was rich and didn't care about money.

Any ideas?


(and I could have put up to 4K on the road without the bolt as that was the last time I was up in there looking around)

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Offline smithr1

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2017, 05:08:44 pm »
First I would be worried why it was missing?  Did it sheer off and the stub still in there?  If left loose, why, should be lock tight and torqued.   After feeling better about why I think I would just get any replacement to get you through the trip and just don't pull wheelies till you have the right spec one back in.
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Offline WANDRNG

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2017, 05:40:16 pm »
Yep. My first thought was "why would that bolt be missing?" But with a 4K ride starting next Wed, I moved on pretty quick to what to do about it.

But... it appears to all still be 100% lined up. a new bolt will twist right in.  There's no remnant of an old bolt inside, so if it sheared, the the remainder worked it self out both even past the joint.

Would this bolt be removed to do a valve adjustment or other standard service?

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Offline jwh20

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2017, 05:40:57 pm »
I would NOT ride the bike with that bolt missing.  That bracket, and the bolts that hold it, are a part of the engine as a stressed member of the frame.  Without that, you will be putting stresses on the bike, frame, engine, and bracket that it was NOT designed to endure and even under normal operation you could seriously damage the bike or crash.  It's NOT worth the risk IMHO.

It's a standard hardware bolt, M10X45 with a washer.  Use BLUE threadlocker on it.  The only thing special about the OEM part is that it comes with threadlocker pre-applied.

Yes, this entire bracket is removed to adjust the valves.
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Offline WANDRNG

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2017, 05:58:32 pm »
Just got noticed today. I won't ride it till fixed (says the guy who rode it home from the dealer, against their gentle recommendation)

Dealer actually found it. I had them do an oil change and a "safety inspection" - check all fluids, pads, look for things out of wack, etc. Cause I'm swamped and wouldn't have made the time before I leave for Wild Wasatch.  They found it while inspecting (hey, at least tells me they were actually looking at stuff today).

I'm a bit of a clueless mechanic so didn't know if it needed a specific rating of bolt or something. Off to the hardware store I go.

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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2017, 07:32:18 pm »
Run over to Lowes, they have a large selection in bins...
Find the M10x45 lg stainless steel socket cap bolts, they should be either 18-8 stainless, or 316 stainless.. (if they have 304 stainless even better).
Both are strong enough in those grades for the application..
Also pick up a flat washer...
Don't go hog wild on the threadlocker, just a small amount is all you need, you don't need to coat the whole bolt....
Torque it per the spec, don't over torque it as when it has locktite, its considered "wet" and easily overtorqued. When I torque "wet" bolts, I reduce the torque by 5 to 8% to be safe.

Also note, a 45mm lg bolt won't be fully threaded, in that size there will be 13mm (1/2") of unthreaded shank, not sure what the OEM had on it, so make sure it doesn't run out of thread before its tightened.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2017, 07:35:49 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

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Offline Deepsea

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2017, 08:41:34 pm »
Your local Ace Hardware will have them in SS or Gr5, or Gr8 or even maybe cad plated. At the Big Box store maybe but at Ace I've always found the ones I needed.
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Offline WANDRNG

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2017, 09:08:18 pm »
Lowe's had, in stainless steel
M10-1.50x35
M10-1.50x50
M10-1.0x40. (&50)

I don't know what M10x45 translates too.
Are either M10-1.0 or M10-1.5. = M10?

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Offline SpeedyCoop

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #8 on: September 06, 2017, 10:50:39 pm »
1.0 and 1.50 are the thread pitch ( do not remember which one it is ). Make sure you have the right one before you spin one in. When I purchased my bike the right side was missing and the other side was loose, took that one out to match to new one.

Offline WANDRNG

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2017, 10:57:51 pm »
I tried ACE to see if I could get the right length.

best I could do is M10-1.50x40 - I'll give it a try ($4 with the washer is better the $48)

looking at the threads at Lowes - was pretty sure it would be a 1.50 - but when you have them both in your hand, you go , huh?

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Offline Deepsea

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2017, 11:56:56 pm »
I think you'd be better off getting one that's 50mm long and cutting 5mm off instead of putting in a bolt that's to short. Although 5mm is only about 3/16" or 0.197". Remember you're putting it into aluminum so every thread counts. An angle grinder with a flap disc will make short work of it. Just don't over heat the bolt.
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Offline Old Man on a Connie

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2017, 12:15:52 am »
Rule of thumb is 1.5 x dia is needed for proper thread penetration. So a 10 mm bolt will require 15 mm engaged thread. Head hurt yet? Is the hole a through hole or blind (closed). Try Mcmaster Carr and MSC. They can usually overnight stuff. Did you try Jake Wilson. Hell, I probably have one in a coffee can on my bench. Nail down the thread pitch (1.0,1.5) and I'll check. PS, check cycle gears trackside bolt kits too. You have some time.
« Last Edit: September 07, 2017, 12:19:54 am by Old Man on a Connie »
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Offline lather

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2017, 12:34:03 am »
i have a spare i can ship you friday. id ship it thursday but i am currently evacuating from key west and wont get home until thursday evening. just pay shipping and replace my bolt at your leisure.

Offline WANDRNG

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2017, 12:47:59 am »
i have a spare i can ship you friday. id ship it thursday but i am currently evacuating from key west and wont get home until thursday evening. just pay shipping and replace my bolt at your leisure.
Lather - I'll get back to you tomorrow and let you know thanks.

Good luck and be safe.

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Offline lather

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2017, 01:03:51 am »
Ok.

Offline WANDRNG

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #15 on: September 07, 2017, 01:11:44 am »
Rule of thumb is 1.5 x dia is needed for proper thread penetration. So a 10 mm bolt will require 15 mm engaged thread. Head hurt yet? Is the hole a through hole or blind (closed). Try Mcmaster Carr and MSC. They can usually overnight stuff. Did you try Jake Wilson. Hell, I probably have one in a coffee can on my bench. Nail down the thread pitch (1.0,1.5) and I'll check. PS, check cycle gears trackside bolt kits too. You have some time.
I can't find, in official writing, what the pitch is. I've found 1.50 and 1.25 in forum threads.  Since I do little work on the C14 I don't have the shop manual which I'm sure provides real numbers.  Everything I find just says M10x45. (which I take to be 1.50 by default)

But as mentioned - aluminum - so I no wanna muck it up.

I was able to gently turn in with my fingers the M10-1.50x40, all the way in till the bolt head touched the mounting bracket and it snugged. That wouldn't happen if the threaded block was 1.25 (or 1.0). Right?

Can anyone confirm pitch 1.50 on the front left lower engine mount bolt - that gets 44 ft-lbs

I don't wanna take the right side bolt out - cause with my luck it would strip or the engine would fall out.

I'm pretty good at a number of things - motorcycle (any) wrenching isn't one of them


McMaster-Carr - 10 pk 18-8 stainless Steel Socket Head Screw, M10 x 1.50mm - 45mm long - $9.10

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Offline Old Man on a Connie

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #16 on: September 07, 2017, 01:37:29 am »
Rule of thumb is 1.5 x dia is needed for proper thread penetration. So a 10 mm bolt will require 15 mm engaged thread. Head hurt yet? Is the hole a through hole or blind (closed). Try Mcmaster Carr and MSC. They can usually overnight stuff. Did you try Jake Wilson. Hell, I probably have one in a coffee can on my bench. Nail down the thread pitch (1.0,1.5) and I'll check. PS, check cycle gears trackside bolt kits too. You have some time.
I can't find, in official writing, what the pitch is. I've found 1.50 and 1.25 in forum threads.  Since I do little work on the C14 I don't have the shop manual which I'm sure provides real numbers.  Everything I find just says M10x45. (which I take to be 1.50 by default)

But as mentioned - aluminum - so I no wanna muck it up.

I was able to gently turn in with my fingers the M10-1.50x40, all the way in till the bolt head touched the mounting bracket and it snugged. That wouldn't happen if the threaded block was 1.25 (or 1.0). Right?

Can anyone confirm pitch 1.50 on the front left lower engine mount bolt - that gets 44 ft-lbs

I don't wanna take the right side bolt out - cause with my luck it would strip or the engine would fall out.

I'm pretty good at a number of things - motorcycle (any) wrenching isn't one of them


McMaster-Carr - 10 pk 18-8 stainless Steel Socket Head Screw, M10 x 1.50mm - 45mm long - $9.10
If you can run it in with fingers pitch is right. 44 ft lbs on a 10 mm bolt? Yikes. Let me check my shop book.
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Offline WANDRNG

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2017, 01:42:43 am »
Rule of thumb is 1.5 x dia is needed for proper thread penetration. So a 10 mm bolt will require 15 mm engaged thread. Head hurt yet? Is the hole a through hole or blind (closed). Try Mcmaster Carr and MSC. They can usually overnight stuff. Did you try Jake Wilson. Hell, I probably have one in a coffee can on my bench. Nail down the thread pitch (1.0,1.5) and I'll check. PS, check cycle gears trackside bolt kits too. You have some time.
I can't find, in official writing, what the pitch is. I've found 1.50 and 1.25 in forum threads.  Since I do little work on the C14 I don't have the shop manual which I'm sure provides real numbers.  Everything I find just says M10x45. (which I take to be 1.50 by default)

But as mentioned - aluminum - so I no wanna muck it up.

I was able to gently turn in with my fingers the M10-1.50x40, all the way in till the bolt head touched the mounting bracket and it snugged. That wouldn't happen if the threaded block was 1.25 (or 1.0). Right?

Can anyone confirm pitch 1.50 on the front left lower engine mount bolt - that gets 44 ft-lbs

I don't wanna take the right side bolt out - cause with my luck it would strip or the engine would fall out.

I'm pretty good at a number of things - motorcycle (any) wrenching isn't one of them


McMaster-Carr - 10 pk 18-8 stainless Steel Socket Head Screw, M10 x 1.50mm - 45mm long - $9.10
If you can run it in with fingers pitch is right. 44 ft lbs on a 10 mm bolt? Yikes. Let me check my shop book.

BTW - the hole does go through - so I can probably just stick a 50mm in to exceed the specified 45mm  (cause I'm guessing the 40mm is right at the 15mm penetration you mentioned)

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Offline Old Man on a Connie

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #18 on: September 07, 2017, 01:45:37 am »
I'll be dinged. pg 5.2 18 R S M10. 44 ft lbs. R is replacement part, S is follow the specified tightening sequence.
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Offline Old Man on a Connie

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #19 on: September 07, 2017, 01:50:45 am »
Rule of thumb is 1.5 x dia is needed for proper thread penetration. So a 10 mm bolt will require 15 mm engaged thread. Head hurt yet? Is the hole a through hole or blind (closed). Try Mcmaster Carr and MSC. They can usually overnight stuff. Did you try Jake Wilson. Hell, I probably have one in a coffee can on my bench. Nail down the thread pitch (1.0,1.5) and I'll check. PS, check cycle gears trackside bolt kits too. You have some time.
I can't find, in official writing, what the pitch is. I've found 1.50 and 1.25 in forum threads.  Since I do little work on the C14 I don't have the shop manual which I'm sure provides real numbers.  Everything I find just says M10x45. (which I take to be 1.50 by default)

But as mentioned - aluminum - so I no wanna muck it up.

I was able to gently turn in with my fingers the M10-1.50x40, all the way in till the bolt head touched the mounting bracket and it snugged. That wouldn't happen if the threaded block was 1.25 (or 1.0). Right?

Can anyone confirm pitch 1.50 on the front left lower engine mount bolt - that gets 44 ft-lbs

I don't wanna take the right side bolt out - cause with my luck it would strip or the engine would fall out.

I'm pretty good at a number of things - motorcycle (any) wrenching isn't one of them


McMaster-Carr - 10 pk 18-8 stainless Steel Socket Head Screw, M10 x 1.50mm - 45mm long - $9.10
If you can run it in with fingers pitch is right. 44 ft lbs on a 10 mm bolt? Yikes. Let me check my shop book.

BTW - the hole does go through - so I can probably just stick a 50mm in to exceed the specified 45mm  (cause I'm guessing the 40mm is right at the 15mm penetration you mentioned)
I'd be comfortable with it.
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Offline WANDRNG

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #20 on: September 07, 2017, 01:53:56 am »
I'd be comfortable with it.
Sorry - comfortable using the 40mm or getting and using the overlong 50mm

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Offline WANDRNG

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #21 on: September 07, 2017, 01:54:59 am »
An angle grinder with a flap disc will make short work of it.
I'd have to buy both  ;D

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Offline Old Man on a Connie

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #22 on: September 07, 2017, 02:01:51 am »
I'd be comfortable with it.
Sorry - comfortable using the 40mm or getting and using the overlong 50mm
Open hole over long. As long as it doesn't punch into something.
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Offline Syxxphive

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #23 on: September 07, 2017, 02:35:29 am »
In metric threads, if no pitch is given, it's assumed to be standard or coarse thread. Bolt will be m10-1.5x45.

Source- am machinist lol.

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Re: Need an engine mount bolt. Fell out...
« Reply #24 on: September 07, 2017, 02:40:27 am »
 
In metric threads, if no pitch is given, it's assumed to be standard or coarse thread. Bolt will be m10-1.5x45.

Source- am machinist lol.
:great: Thanks!

I know I'm being overcautious  :-[    it comes from being a lousy mechanic with history to prove it.

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