Author Topic: Need jump start help  (Read 1096 times)

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Offline parttimer`

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Need jump start help
« on: August 24, 2017, 01:30:41 pm »
So yesterday i did the dumb thing of flipping the switch to stop the motor but didn't turn the key to the off position.  Left myself with a dead battery.  After 45 minutes of being hooked up to a car, it still wouldn't jump.  I have it on a charger now, but I have noticed what they say is the positive terminal looks like the battery is installed backwards.  See photo!  Of course I am at work, the toolkit included doesn't have the right size allen key to remove the plate, luckily I was able to find one here at the office, but do I need to move my battery?

Offline gPink

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2017, 01:37:20 pm »
oops!
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Offline 4Bikes

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2017, 01:41:54 pm »
This is what your battery should look like when installed properly.  The Red booted terminal gets the Positive lead.  Not sure what issues you will have going forward with that reverse polarity.   ::)

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Offline JMB

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2017, 01:47:22 pm »
Yup...oops is right!!
As mentioned above, You'll be lucky if nothing was damaged during the attempt to jump start with reversed leads!

Offline parttimer`

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2017, 02:31:07 pm »
Did they make a model year change?  The bike was of course "inspected" when I picked it up.  it's an 2017.

Offline 4Bikes

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2017, 02:34:06 pm »
The Dealer preps the Bike, and that includes installing the battery.  I think you have a serious beef with them......
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Offline Warwgn

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2017, 02:53:38 pm »
That sucks, just try to remember RED to RED and BLACK to BLACK, too late now but bet you will remember next time to take a close look. I would guess you were in a rush and ready to go so just didn't have your mind on the task, happens to the best of us, I hope it works out ok and I think worst case you will only need a new battery.

Offline Zarticus

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2017, 03:11:50 pm »
So yesterday i did the dumb thing of flipping the switch to stop the motor but didn't turn the key to the off position.  Left myself with a dead battery.  After 45 minutes of being hooked up to a car, it still wouldn't jump.  I have it on a charger now, but I have noticed what they say is the positive terminal looks like the battery is installed backwards.  See photo!  Of course I am at work, the toolkit included doesn't have the right size allen key to remove the plate, luckily I was able to find one here at the office, but do I need to move my battery?
As seen clearly in your picture that big old negative sign in white on the side of the Battery is not where you connect the positive.Even though the battery is installed backwards it's still clearly marked  :beerchug:
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Offline gpd323

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2017, 03:21:09 pm »
Some of the early years ZX14's came out of dealerships with the battery backwards just like in your picture. I sure hope you did not fry something. That could be really dangerous attaching the wrong polarity during a jump.
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Offline parttimer`

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2017, 03:28:25 pm »
Ok, so I still don't have a running bike.  I have the bike off the charger.  What do I need to do to get the damn thing started.  There is no RED wire anywhere.  The battery has a negative wire that goes to the bolt, but there is nowhere for me to connect to the positive terminal.

Offline Trey

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2017, 03:32:20 pm »
You're going to need to pull the battery out of its hole.  The Neg side of the battery should go into the bike first.  My dealer did the same thing on my 2008.  Buy a new battery and put it in correctly pay particular attention to the red wire going to + side of the battery.  Good luck

Offline smithr1

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2017, 03:45:14 pm »
On a 2017 I would call the dealer, say they installed the battery backwards and you messed up my bike come fix it NOW.  I would not mention the jump starting thing. :)
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Offline smithr1

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2017, 03:53:11 pm »
What puzzles me is if the bike was working than its battery is hooked up correct just installed wrong.   If you put the positive jump wire on the negative lead as shown than no big deal UNTIL you hook the negative jump wire from the car to the bike.  If you did that you should have made a direct short to the cars battery.   Sparks should fly and bad things happen.  If you never hooked a ground lead up than there is a change nothing bad happened. 

Remove the battery.  Charge it a long time and install it correct.   Or like I said call the dealer and yell a lot.
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Offline parttimer`

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2017, 04:09:34 pm »
I've messaged my dealer already, I bought if about 100 miles away, not to mention I am at work and my tools consist of what is under the seat.  The battery is just in backward, the negative line is on the correct terminal, I just can't reach the positive terminal to jump it!

Offline Trey

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2017, 04:27:48 pm »
Fist thing your gonna need to do is get your battery out and get it turned to where the negative side of the battery is inside the compartment.  Then you may have a chance of getting it started with jumper cables.  You have to have access to the positive terminal of the battery first and foremost.  Hopefully you have enough tools to be able to do that.  Good luck

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #15 on: August 24, 2017, 04:32:34 pm »
Yep, i just pulled the battery out, I have it by itself on the charger.  I don't see how, in the confines of that small space the battery can be inserted the other way.  I am stuck on the phone with a support call so I can step out here and there between things I need to do!  This really stinks!

Offline strum

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #16 on: August 24, 2017, 04:43:52 pm »
Please keep us in updated on the outcome here.  I think your gonna be good after a charge. If you never hooked up both cables and/or didn't have the key on I dont see any harm. Could have been a mess though.
 Edit: I see you said you had it hooked up . Hope you good . please let us know
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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #17 on: August 24, 2017, 05:15:11 pm »
This should look a little better.  Turned the battery around, still need to make sure the battery cover fits, I have it charging now.  It did start, battery shows 11v on the cluster. 

Offline smithr1

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #18 on: August 24, 2017, 05:29:04 pm »
Yes, more charge.   If it is below 12.1 on the display with the key on and not started yet it is weak  Below 12 and it will not even start.
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Offline 4Bikes

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #19 on: August 24, 2017, 06:05:02 pm »
If you do need a new battery, spring for an EarthX Lithium Iron.  It will last you 8 years, is much lighter, and approx. half the size of the lead acid.  It also shuts down if discharged like you experienced.  The convertible terminals are easier to connect as well.  I recommend have the ETX24C or you can upgrade further to the ERX36C.

Ok, this is going to sound like and ad now...... :truce:  I've had this battery for 2 1/2 years, and it cranks like crazy.

Here are the advantages of this battery.
http://earthxmotorsports.com/our-batteries/#technology

◾Light-weight — 70-80% less weight
◾Long Service Life — Up to 4000 charge / discharge cycles (~3-8 years), over 4 times the life of a lead-acid battery
◾Longer Storage Life – due to extremely low self-discharge rate, no need for charging in the off-season
◾Environmentally Friendly — non-toxic, non-contaminating, lead free and no hazardous materials
◾Wide Operating Temperature Range (-30 C–+60C) — lithium batteries are dry cell technology and will not freeze
◾Fast Charge — can be fully charged in less than a half hour
◾Maintenance Free
◾No Special Mounting Direction
◾Safety and Reliability — internal cells are continually monitored by an integrated battery management system

The key advantages of Earthx lithium batteries over competitors lithium batteries;
◾Safety, performance and longevity are very important in the design of the EarthX battery and is the leader in the lithium market with the only battery management system included inside every battery to protect from over discharge, over charge, cell balancing, and excessive cranking protection.
◾All our products are engineered in the USA
◾We use American battery technology, the most advanced lithium battery technology in the world
◾Our batteries are assembled, engineered and designed  in the USA using US and foreign components.
◾No expensive balancing charger needed.
◾Flexible battery connection — our batteries can be used in either left or right side polarity applications. You also have the option to connect the battery leads directly to your vehicle.






Silver 2011 C-14. Previous rides: KZ-400, KZ-750, KZ-1000.  Keep the rubber side down.  Ride Fast......Live Slow......

Offline Trey

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #20 on: August 24, 2017, 06:17:57 pm »
At least you got it started good deal.  Next time your at your dealer make sure to stop by the service dept.  Like I said earlier this is not the only concours that has had the battery installed backward from the dealer but they should know better. 

Offline Gixerhp

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #21 on: August 24, 2017, 06:45:24 pm »
If you do need a new battery, spring for an EarthX Lithium Iron.  It will last you 8 years, is much lighter, and approx. half the size of the lead acid.  It also shuts down if discharged like you experienced.  The convertible terminals are easier to connect as well.  I recommend have the ETX24C or you can upgrade further to the ERX36C.

Ok, this is going to sound like and ad now...... :truce:  I've had this battery for 2 1/2 years, and it cranks like crazy.

Here are the advantages of this battery.
http://earthxmotorsports.com/our-batteries/#technology

◾Light-weight — 70-80% less weight
◾Long Service Life — Up to 4000 charge / discharge cycles (~3-8 years), over 4 times the life of a lead-acid battery
◾Longer Storage Life – due to extremely low self-discharge rate, no need for charging in the off-season
◾Environmentally Friendly — non-toxic, non-contaminating, lead free and no hazardous materials
◾Wide Operating Temperature Range (-30 C–+60C) — lithium batteries are dry cell technology and will not freeze
◾Fast Charge — can be fully charged in less than a half hour
◾Maintenance Free
◾No Special Mounting Direction
◾Safety and Reliability — internal cells are continually monitored by an integrated battery management system

The key advantages of Earthx lithium batteries over competitors lithium batteries;
◾Safety, performance and longevity are very important in the design of the EarthX battery and is the leader in the lithium market with the only battery management system included inside every battery to protect from over discharge, over charge, cell balancing, and excessive cranking protection.
◾All our products are engineered in the USA
◾We use American battery technology, the most advanced lithium battery technology in the world
◾Our batteries are assembled, engineered and designed  in the USA using US and foreign components.
◾No expensive balancing charger needed.
◾Flexible battery connection — our batteries can be used in either left or right side polarity applications. You also have the option to connect the battery leads directly to your vehicle.
I wouldn't spend more money on a battery, i would bring the bike back to the dealer,, no questions asked. The mechanic at the dealer is an idiot! Flat out
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Offline 4Bikes

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #22 on: August 24, 2017, 06:53:21 pm »
I wouldn't spend more money on a battery, i would bring the bike back to the dealer,, no questions asked. The mechanic at the dealer is an idiot! Flat out

+1  I was clueing in more about his comment about the battery compartment being so darn tight.  I would not pay for a new battery at this point either. 
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Online MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #23 on: August 24, 2017, 07:50:09 pm »
This is what your battery should look like when installed properly.  The Red booted terminal gets the Positive lead.  Not sure what issues you will have going forward with that reverse polarity.   ::)




To the O/P....

The picture 4bikes showed is what it should look like, not like the picture you posted of your "corrected battery position"..
I should know... the picture is MY bikes battery, and the additional red wire and black, are wires I INSTALLED when I installed my remotely mounted fuse panel for extra circuits......(all cool tho, was wondering how that picture popped up, photobucket issue...)  wanted to clarify those extra power leads to reduce confusion..
As for your battery, I have no clue about what that "wadded up bundle" of black wire is sitting on top of your battery.. it shouldn't be there.. also, note, you need to rotate that positive cable outwards, and make it look like my battery... another issue is you don't have the protective plastic shield, that was to be installed when that battery was shoved in there...or for that matter the sheetmetal retaining bracket that spans the bottom to hold it in place also... your bike was asssmbled by a bumbling idiot at the delaership, and needs to be installed correctly, with the barrier in place, the ground and positive cables corrected, and the rubber strap holding the battery and barrier in place...and the bottom retaining bracket.. bolted in... you are missing parts dude.....

Not sure WHY you are attempting to charge the battery installed either, as you pulled it out to switch it... should have charged it out of the bike at that time, so you could correctly connect those charger cables directly to the battery terminals... I say this because you choice on the ground connection for the charger leaves much to be desired... its attached to a bolthead, that contacts and holds 2 painted parts together.. a poor ground at the least...

Get the dealer involved, go to the owner of the dealership....
When you attempted to jump the bike and also during your attempts of chargeing it initially, with the positive charger lead clipped on the negative terminal, you effectively reduced that battries life expectancy by 75%.... even tho you think it "may" take a charge now, internal degfadation of the plates, and electrolyte have already taken place....

Sad to see on a 2017 with 100 miles on it....

In looking further at your photo, the last one, what is that white spooge behind and below the battery? I also noticed a "wet spot" at the top rear of the battery in your first pic.... I think that battery is hosed,  primarily from the initial 45 minutes of being connected to another battery, and then attempting to jump it, and then attempting to charge it all with reversed power... prior to correcting it..
Luckily for you, somewhat, that the battery must have been fully discharged prior, as doing those things with a half charge on the battery would have resulted in an explosion for certain, actually, when you corrected the position, and the leads, and further attached the charger, there was an even greater chance.
The chemical reations that took place inside there were seriously dangerous...
« Last Edit: August 24, 2017, 10:45:52 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

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Offline parttimer`

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Re: Need jump start help
« Reply #24 on: August 25, 2017, 10:48:16 am »
The post of the cables connected were when i tried to start it.  I did pull the battery to charge it prior to putting it back in.  I saw 14v during my ride in this morning.  I plan on calling the dealer to let them know it looks like some pieces parts MAY be missing.  My battery try looks different that yours, the tray has holes at the bottom that the batter cover has pins that slide into to hold the tray in place, i wonder if that was a model year change since yours has a bracket taht holds it in place.  I also wondered about the rubber strap holding the battery down, I don't have that either.