Author Topic: Normal idle at startup? New bike  (Read 1038 times)

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Offline asguthrie

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Normal idle at startup? New bike
« on: April 15, 2018, 02:16:47 am »
With a FI bike now (coming off an 02 Bandit 12),I honestly expected that the initial rpms after startup would jump up for 20-30 seconds before settling down to normal.  My 2016, still breaking in, with 200 miles or so, pretty much just starts and stays at 1100, no changes.  Weather here in Nebraska has been cool, usually 40-60degrees at startup. 

Would you guys consider that normal?  Just curious with a dash of new-bike paranoia.

I appreciate the feedback. 

—Aaron

Offline TimR

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2018, 03:29:08 pm »
Pretty normal for the C14. At least for my 09. Congrats on the bike and welcome to the forum. And fear the corn. ;)  Oh wait that's for non Huskers.
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Offline Claude aka MotorcycleClaude

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2018, 04:48:36 pm »
Hi All,

In ECO mode, the revs will climb higher then down.  It's a different fuel map than Normal mode.  Left button on the Handlebar, press down for a few seconds will change to ECO mode.  This resets to "Normal" mode after shut down.  When you get a chance, read through the owners manual, lot of valuable information.

Claude
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Offline asguthrie

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2018, 10:00:53 pm »
I appreciate the help!

So far, I've not had the Eco-mode on -- I might give that a shot and see if there's a difference; the manual doesn't hint that there's an idle difference between the two modes, not that I've seen yet. I'd think that a cold idle would be normal regardless of riding mode, but I'm the noob here, so I'll shut up and listen.  :sign0104:

According to the manual, "While the engine is cold, the fast idle system automatically raises the engine idling speed".   Of course, I'm not sure how the engine defines "cold", but would assume (dangerous?) that cold = not ridden for more than 4-5+ hours.

 I won't sweat it for the time being.

-Aaron

On a side note:  Die, winter, DIE!!  Snow in April ain't right.  :-[

Offline jwh20

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2018, 11:25:19 pm »
I could be mistaken but the 2015+ models have an O2 sensor in the exhaust that gives closed-loop feedback to the ECU that is not there on earlier models.  I do know that my 2012, lacking the O2 sensor, does idle faster on a cold start and then it drops back after a minute or two.  I suspect this is an emissions-related behavior used to heat up the catalyst quickly.  On a newer model with an O2 sensor, the faster idle may be skipped if the ECU is satisfied with the exhaust gas content.
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Offline asguthrie

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2018, 10:52:58 pm »
I could be mistaken but the 2015+ models have an O2 sensor in the exhaust that gives closed-loop feedback to the ECU that is not there on earlier models.  I do know that my 2012, lacking the O2 sensor, does idle faster on a cold start and then it drops back after a minute or two.  I suspect this is an emissions-related behavior used to heat up the catalyst quickly.  On a newer model with an O2 sensor, the faster idle may be skipped if the ECU is satisfied with the exhaust gas content.

Outstanding!  -- maybe the user manual just wasn't updated to reflect that information info for the newer models.  This is a rational explanation -- much appreciated.   :beerchug:

Offline JaL3

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2018, 09:31:43 pm »
My 2016 runs on higher rpms on idle a minute or so after cold start. No ECO mode.
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2018, 10:24:34 pm »
I could be mistaken but the 2015+ models have an O2 sensor in the exhaust that gives closed-loop feedback to the ECU that is not there on earlier models.  I do know that my 2012, lacking the O2 sensor, does idle faster on a cold start and then it drops back after a minute or two.  I suspect this is an emissions-related behavior used to heat up the catalyst quickly.  On a newer model with an O2 sensor, the faster idle may be skipped if the ECU is satisfied with the exhaust gas content.

Outstanding!  -- maybe the user manual just wasn't updated to reflect that information info for the newer models.  This is a rational explanation -- much appreciated.   :beerchug:

User manuals, even this models one, do not get into a lot of detail, its a bsic book telling you what needs service when, and how the bike "works". I.e. controls.

As for higher idle, I don't think ANY of these models, since inception, idle HIGH for a full minute... maybe 20-30 seconds tops... my '08 from a cold start in normal 50*+ temps, doesn't even take 10 seconds to trim. And in reality, its all controlled by the ECU and throttle position sensors and throttle body plates, to "continually from cold.start, adjust in a very passive mode" the intake mixture to effectively warm the exhaust and engine with little or no perception of what is taking place..  it fuels effectively without added rider input.. and should.

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Offline flashback50

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2018, 12:07:08 am »
I never liked idea of a cold engine running at higher idle before oil is flowing good.

Offline gpd323

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2018, 12:19:02 am »
54 degrees, my bike a 2013. Started it up and idle went to 1300 and after 30 seconds or so went to 1100 rpms and thats where it stayed.

I have had the idle go up as far as 2K when its really cold out and then settle down to normal idle after a short warm up period.

Your bike is fine, do not worry about it.

 :beerchug:
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Offline asguthrie

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2018, 10:35:22 am »
Go figure, as soon as I post this and am satisfied, I fired it up Tuesday evening, 60 degrees with about 247 mile on the odo ,  bike fired up and high idled about 1400 rpm or so for a minute before settling in.   :-[

Offline Bigfoot_16

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2018, 11:31:37 am »
On Monday evenings I ride my bike for about 15 minutes to a weekly meeting. 2 1/2 hours later I ride home. When I start the bike at home for the meeting it idles at about 1300 RPM for several seconds. I stop for a red traffic light within two minutes and the idle drops to 1000 RPM. Three minutes later at the next red light it idles at 1100 RPM and remains there at subsequent stops.

When I start the bike for the ride home, this is where it gets more interesting. Initially the idle is about 1000 RPM. Then after about five seconds it drops to 800 RPM and sometimes dies. After riding for a few minutes, then the idle returns to 1100 RPM. This 2015 C14 has done this since new. That's some really odd behavior and sometimes I rev the engine on the warmer start to keep it running. It's odd, but I live with it as is.
Jim

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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2018, 09:55:53 pm »
Go figure, as soon as I post this and am satisfied, I fired it up Tuesday evening, 60 degrees with about 247 mile on the odo ,  bike fired up and high idled about 1400 rpm or so for a minute before settling in.   :-[

Its been sooo many years since I first had 250 miles on the bike, I'll say that its still normal, when the bike has 2,500 &  25,000 miles on it, report back, I'm sure its just simply breaking in..

As for older bikes with higher miles, id suspect an air filter may need changing..

Y'all ride safe, :great:

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Offline gilbysan

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2018, 03:00:11 pm »
Coggers,

Lots of interesting experiences here.  I bought my '12 with 2K on the ODO.  It starts up and idle high for 45-60 seconds then settles in at ~1100RPM.  I noted that if I turn the throttle grip forward with a bit of pressure as if to decel, it will reduce the idle speed, when I let it go it idles back up until that mysterious time period lapses and it settles to ~1100.

Here is my ask- When I first started riding the '12, it was averaging 32-36 MPG, lower than my recently departed '13 Connie which had ~35K on it.  Did not seem to matter how I rode.  Right about 3K miles the MPG increased to the 38-40 MPG range. 

Are those Kawasaki Coders creative enough to program in a fuel map that keeps the engine rich for a break in period, then move to another map once the bike is ridden for a number of miles?  Since crossing the 3K mileage line, I am seeing 38-41 MPG in town depending how hard I goose it, and does not drop below 36 MPG other than for short periods of HSLD riding.  Overall the tank to tank Avg. MPG stays right at 38-41 MPG.

Since I have not figured out how to travel back in time or miles, I am left wondering about this potentially undocumented feature?

Safe Travels!

Gilbysan
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2018, 03:27:09 pm »
At 2k, the engine, and rings were still seating in... after a douple more, they have worn in, and sealed as well as they will, prior to that during breakin, some exhaust and fuel loss thru compression does result in a lower mpg reading..

The first couple tanks of fuel I burned on my '08 new, were about 32 mpg... after 20k, it now is consistant at 42 mpg, and when it dips to 40 mpg, I know I need a new airfilter...

Normal... no issue, :great: :great: :motonoises:

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Offline RoadKillHeaven

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #15 on: April 23, 2018, 09:08:13 am »
My '16 has its own mind. Most of the times it starts up and settles just over 1100 revs. On occasion, revs hoover around 1500 rpm and then settle down around 1100 revs.
The strange thing I've noticed with my '16 is slight fluctuations upon start up(cold or hot). It'd take 5-10 sec for revs to stabilize.
 
 

Offline jwh20

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2018, 05:57:11 pm »
I could be mistaken but the 2015+ models have an O2 sensor in the exhaust that gives closed-loop feedback to the ECU that is not there on earlier models.  I do know that my 2012, lacking the O2 sensor, does idle faster on a cold start and then it drops back after a minute or two.  I suspect this is an emissions-related behavior used to heat up the catalyst quickly.  On a newer model with an O2 sensor, the faster idle may be skipped if the ECU is satisfied with the exhaust gas content.

Outstanding!  -- maybe the user manual just wasn't updated to reflect that information info for the newer models.  This is a rational explanation -- much appreciated.   :beerchug:

User manuals, even this models one, do not get into a lot of detail, its a bsic book telling you what needs service when, and how the bike "works". I.e. controls.

As for higher idle, I don't think ANY of these models, since inception, idle HIGH for a full minute... maybe 20-30 seconds tops... my '08 from a cold start in normal 50*+ temps, doesn't even take 10 seconds to trim. And in reality, its all controlled by the ECU and throttle position sensors and throttle body plates, to "continually from cold.start, adjust in a very passive mode" the intake mixture to effectively warm the exhaust and engine with little or no perception of what is taking place..  it fuels effectively without added rider input.. and should.

I wheeled my 2012 out of the garage into the nice and sunny 65F air today to clean her up.  I started the bike without touching the throttle and the RPMs went to about 1200 or so.  After exactly 120 seconds it dropped down to 1000 RPM and stayed there from that point on.  While it's possible that this behavior is 2012 specific, I suspect it's more general across years.  There may be other conditions that affect how high the RPM goes and how long, if at all, it's elevated but clearly there is some programmed behavior here.

The good news, however, is that Winter may finally have ended!
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Offline Upstate Pete

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Re: Normal idle at startup? New bike
« Reply #17 on: April 29, 2018, 03:41:51 am »
Yea, my 2012 does go up to a slight amount for a minute on cold start. Higher if ECO mode is engaged. I've also had it stumble when no warm up time is given on cool mornings.