Author Topic: Slip on vs stock muffler  (Read 903 times)

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Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Slip on vs stock muffler
« on: June 01, 2018, 12:26:01 pm »
A follow up to the "slip ons, manufacturers claims" thread.

I'm doing some dyno work with my bike, and had occasion to run the stock ecu with a slip on, and also with a stock muffler. The slip on is an area p 2" thru pipe 18".  Virtually the same as all othe c-14 slip ons from Delkevic to Akrapovic. These charts are rendered in uncorrected form, so it's the actual power measured with no correction factor involved. Weather conditions for both runs were virtually identical. Each run was the best of 3. At peak power the slip on shows a SOLID 2 hp gain.

Steve
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2018, 12:35:45 pm »
2 HP seems to be a reasonable number and is nice to have at 9200 ..
But, I'm more impressed by the torque/HP increase that starts around 5500..!!

Ride safe, Ted
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Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2018, 01:49:28 pm »
2 HP seems to be a reasonable number and is nice to have at 9200 ..
But, I'm more impressed by the torque/HP increase that starts around 5500..!!

Ride safe, Ted

it's 2 # TQ  gained.

 Steve
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Offline ConcoursKZ

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2018, 01:58:30 pm »
The old rule was 6lbs of weight = 1hp. So if you lose the stock potato launcher and swap it. You should gain an additional 2 or 3 hp there. LMAO
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Offline Roger B

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2018, 02:07:53 pm »
I have the stock can on mine and will keep it on, but I do appreciate the sound of most aftermarket cans.   It's nice that you actually gained a little hp and torque.    On my 2 stroke snowmobiles replacing the stock muffler with aftermarket cans always loses hp/torque, replacing the y-pipe and exhaust pipe though is a different story.   The way you tested is a good apples to apples comparison.   Would of been cool to see the decibel comparison to stock.

Online Harry Martin

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2018, 02:10:46 pm »
The old rule was 6lbs of weight = 1hp. So if you lose the stock potato launcher and swap it. You should gain an additional 2 or 3 hp there. LMAO

On a dyno?
Is weight a factor on a dyno?
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Offline ConcoursKZ

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2018, 02:14:17 pm »
It was a joke.
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Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2018, 02:19:36 pm »
to those who are interested in this stuff, here's some info. the stock fueling is to rich . When the slipon is added it pulls the a/f ratio closer to where it should be.

 Steve

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2018, 02:53:03 pm »
It was a joke.

I wouldn't know better. Interesting stuff.
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Offline Roger B

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2018, 04:18:39 pm »
to those who are interested in this stuff, here's some info. the stock fueling is to rich . When the slipon is added it pulls the a/f ratio closer to where it should be.

 Steve


Steve, I was wondering if that could of been a factor.   Good analysis.

Offline connie_rider

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2018, 06:52:29 pm »
2 HP seems to be a reasonable number and is nice to have at 9200 ..
But, I'm more impressed by the torque/HP increase that starts around 5500..!!

Ride safe, Ted

it's 2 # TQ  gained.

 Steve

Better yet; It's 1 - 2 ft/lbs of torque gained over an extended RPM range. {from 5500 to 9500}

Ride safe, Ted
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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2018, 12:24:56 pm »
I have the older ZX14  header pipe with two brothers cans , I use the smallest reducers (three sizes) they sell , when I took them out to do the track day  with our group last year the sound was intoxicating !
You can hear every crackle , pop , It was really sweet , but for me too loud for the street , so I understand those that must have that sound , but I was driving faster than usual and scared of getting a ticket :beerchug:

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Offline br

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2018, 01:28:13 pm »
So Steve, if the the stock fueling is to rich, and I have no doubt you are right, why is it then when some put after market mufflers on they experience popping. Meaning to lean.

Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #13 on: June 02, 2018, 01:49:41 pm »
So Steve, if the the stock fueling is to rich, and I have no doubt you are right, why is it then when some put after market mufflers on they experience popping. Meaning to lean.

We're talking about different points in throttle position. Have you ever heard your concours popping at WOT? Dyno runs are depicted in WOT. Popping is at zero closed throttle. Steve
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Offline Upstate Pete

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #14 on: June 03, 2018, 12:59:53 am »
You gain much more in weight savings than you do in power or torque. I did the two brothers titanium slip on and a K&N filter.(saved 18 lbs over stock). I tried using PC-V's recommended map for two brothers and found it too rich, with blackened plugs. Maybe due to the P1-X suppressor I added because two brothers alone was too obnoxious for me. Now I use one of the other PC-V maps that is a little leaner and after another 30,000 miles the plugs are medium brown. Most importantly, the sound is so much better than the old potato cannon the connie comes with. All in all, about $750 for great sound and 18 or so lbs in weight savings. I'm happy with it.

Offline Wolverine

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #15 on: June 03, 2018, 01:36:20 am »
Which map did you use?

You gain much more in weight savings than you do in power or torque. I did the two brothers titanium slip on and a K&N filter.(saved 18 lbs over stock). I tried using PC-V's recommended map for two brothers and found it too rich, with blackened plugs. Maybe due to the P1-X suppressor I added because two brothers alone was too obnoxious for me. Now I use one of the other PC-V maps that is a little leaner and after another 30,000 miles the plugs are medium brown. Most importantly, the sound is so much better than the old potato cannon the connie comes with. All in all, about $750 for great sound and 18 or so lbs in weight savings. I'm happy with it.
Thanks

Rick

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Offline Upstate Pete

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #16 on: June 03, 2018, 02:26:42 am »
Hey Wolverine,

I'll try to let you know tomorrow which map I ended up using. I'm in the midst of a valve adjustment. I got the new shims in and the cams reinstalled but have a lot of reassembly to do yet. PC-V had 5 maps to download when I got mine. Obviously the two brothers one is out, as is the "zero" map. I'll plug her in tomorrow and let you know. I think she's still a tad rich but am happy with medium brown plugs. Also, I am pretty close to sea level here in NY at about 500 ft, and when I do use ECO mode, I have noticed a bit of stumble when trying to accelerate off cruising speed. So I just don't use ECO mode unless I really need to save gas.

Offline Wolverine

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #17 on: June 03, 2018, 02:43:42 am »
ECO Mode?? I guess something else I have to dig into.

I have an 09 and where the pics show a "mode" switch I have a switch that momentarily flashes my high beams
Thanks

Rick

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Offline AmphibSailor

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #18 on: June 03, 2018, 07:31:20 am »
08 and 09 did not have eco mode.  If you used the PCV you could set up 2 maps....I used to run the PCV with a performance map in one slot and a eco map in the other.
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Offline Wolverine

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #19 on: June 03, 2018, 10:40:56 am »
I assume to switch between the 2 maps you have to hook back up to a computer to switch?
Thanks

Rick

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #20 on: June 03, 2018, 10:50:28 am »
I assume to switch between the 2 maps you have to hook back up to a computer to switch?


Nope.  Just a switch mounted somewhere you can reach...and you wire it to the PCV.  (There's a readily accessible input available.) I bought the one sold by powercommander but it is not necessary to get that one. <---Click  If you look at the manual, you can read about switching maps and how to connect it.

Really...it would be much simpler and more reliable to get Steve's flash.  Your gas mileage will increase if you ride more sanely.  :motonoises: :motonoises:  ;D

« Last Edit: June 03, 2018, 10:57:09 am by AmphibSailor »
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Offline Wolverine

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #21 on: June 03, 2018, 12:20:14 pm »
Yes, spoke to Steve last week.

But I also see there is an Ivan flash, which is the better way to go?
Thanks

Rick

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #22 on: June 03, 2018, 01:22:51 pm »
That's really a personal decision.  I have Steve's flash and I highly recommend it.  Steve has supported the COG community for several years. Do some research on this forum and see for yourself.  I feel I can vouch for Steve's character and integrity but I don't have any good things to say about Ivan.
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Offline ConcoursKZ

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #23 on: June 03, 2018, 02:15:18 pm »
That's really a personal decision.  I have Steve's flash and I highly recommend it.  Steve has supported the COG community for several years. Do some research on this forum and see for yourself.  I feel I can vouch for Steve's character and integrity but I don't have any good things to say about Ivan.

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Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: Slip on vs stock muffler
« Reply #24 on: June 03, 2018, 02:25:44 pm »
That's really a personal decision.  I have Steve's flash and I highly recommend it.  Steve has supported the COG community for several years. Do some research on this forum and see for yourself.  I feel I can vouch for Steve's character and integrity but I don't have any good things to say about Ivan.

   While I appreciate the kind words, and despite all the water under the bridge, I have never heard anything bad about Ivan's work or his customer service.  While he and I may have different approaches and goals in what we do, at least he's put the work in, which is more than I can say for any other flashes I know of.

  Steve
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