Author Topic: Suspected oil pan leak  (Read 583 times)

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Offline Kreton'sLC

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Suspected oil pan leak
« on: July 10, 2019, 04:15:17 pm »
My Connie has developed an oil leak which I believe is coming from the oil pan.  In the photo below you can see one of the pan bolts has oil on it, and there's another drop a few inches to the left near another pan bolt.  But you'll also notice the area directly above the oily bolt looks oily.  Is this probably due to drips from a leaky oil pan gasket being blown up and back while riding, or could the leak be from somewhere else?

If the oil pan gasket is the problem, will it require replacement or are there other ways of fixing it, e.g. dabbing some Permatex on the area of the leak?

Offline Bumblebee

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2019, 06:32:14 pm »
Could this be in any way related to the bump you took on your exhaust pipes?  Could you have hit the pan at the same time?  Also, an external application of Permatex will not help.  Good luck!
« Last Edit: July 10, 2019, 06:37:03 pm by Bumblebee, Reason: clarification »

Offline Kreton'sLC

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2019, 07:14:09 pm »
Could this be in any way related to the bump you took on your exhaust pipes?  Could you have hit the pan at the same time?  Also, an external application of Permatex will not help.  Good luck!

No, I actually noticed the drip prior to bumping the exhaust and took it to a Yamaha dealer (the local Kawasaki dealer said he was too busy to look at it).  The guy at the Yamaha dealer thought it was leaking from the oil pan, but since I later discovered oil leaking from the drain plug, I thought perhaps the oil from the drain plug leak was just blowing back to the pan, making it appear like the leak was coming from it. 

So when I got home from my trip I tightened the drain plug, which stopped that leak.  But over the last few days I've confirmed the pan appears to be leaking as well, just like the Yamaha service guy said.  However, there are absolutely no marks on it to indicate it was impacted when I went off the curb and bumped my exhaust.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2019, 07:58:47 pm by Kreton'sLC »

Offline ghostrider990

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2019, 02:39:30 am »
When In doubt as to the source of the leak, de-grease the area thoroughly, and start over.

Now closely monitor the leak, and where it emanates from......should be more obvious this time around.

It's the lowest point on the engine, and the blowing effect of oil can transfer that slick s*** all over the place!

Curiosity: what year bike, and what brand oil??

Is the filter tight??  Just spit-balling here.....

gr
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Offline Kreton'sLC

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2019, 11:16:07 am »
When In doubt as to the source of the leak, de-grease the area thoroughly, and start over.

Now closely monitor the leak, and where it emanates from......should be more obvious this time around.

It's the lowest point on the engine, and the blowing effect of oil can transfer that slick s*** all over the place!

Curiosity: what year bike, and what brand oil??

Is the filter tight??  Just spit-balling here.....

gr

2012 model.  Oil is whatever the Kawasaki dealer used.  Apparently they changed it when I recently brought it in for a valve clearance inspection, but didn't put it on the invoice.  I discovered they'd done so when I first noticed the leak and tried to tighten the K&N filter I'd put on and discovered a Kawasaki filter instead!

Will give it a thorough degreasing like you suggest, and now that I have one of those Harbor Freight vice grip style filter wrenches, use it to ensure the filter is tight.

Offline TireguyfromMA

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2019, 10:58:12 pm »
Don't use a wrench to tighten an oil filter on! You might never get it off. Oil filters should only be put on as tight as you can with your hand...not kidding this time.   Oil filter wrenches should only be used to remove the filter.  It's also a good practice to lubricate the oil filter o-ring with the new oil before installing.

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Offline Bud

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2019, 11:32:15 pm »
Don't use a wrench to tighten an oil filter on! You might never get it off. Oil filters should only be put on as tight as you can with your hand...not kidding this time.   Oil filter wrenches should only be used to remove the filter.  It's also a good practice to lubricate the oil filter o-ring with the new oil before installing.
:iagree:
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Offline Kreton'sLC

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2019, 11:32:09 am »
Don't use a wrench to tighten an oil filter on! You might never get it off. Oil filters should only be put on as tight as you can with your hand...not kidding this time.   Oil filter wrenches should only be used to remove the filter.  It's also a good practice to lubricate the oil filter o-ring with the new oil before installing.

I basically agree and always oil the o-ring before installation, but the Connie's low clearance makes it difficult to get the leverage to tighten sufficiently by hand IMO.  I typically use K&N filters, tighten by hand, then use a wrench on the top nut to tighten just a bit more - maybe 1/16th of a turn more.  My intention with the HF wrench is to see if it's sufficiently tight by seeing whether effort would be required to tighten it more.  If so, I won't tighten it any more.

Offline ghostrider990

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2019, 12:09:28 pm »
When In doubt as to the source of the leak, de-grease the area thoroughly, and start over.

Now closely monitor the leak, and where it emanates from......should be more obvious this time around.

It's the lowest point on the engine, and the blowing effect of oil can transfer that slick s*** all over the place!

Curiosity: what year bike, and what brand oil??

Is the filter tight??  Just spit-balling here.....

gr

2012 model.  Oil is whatever the Kawasaki dealer used.  Apparently they changed it when I recently brought it in for a valve clearance inspection, but didn't put it on the invoice.  I discovered they'd done so when I first noticed the leak and tried to tighten the K&N filter I'd put on and discovered a Kawasaki filter instead!

Will give it a thorough degreasing like you suggest, and now that I have one of those Harbor Freight vice grip style filter wrenches, use it to ensure the filter is tight.

I'm oft suspicious of "charity" work by dealerships, because there is NO SUCH thing in the service world.
I'd go back over the invoice to see if the oil change was part of the overall service quotation, and if the parts (oil/filter/crush washer) were literally annotated in the parts section.

Why you ask?
Well, now you have a "free" oil change on your bike that you didn't necessarily ask for, and now you have an (alleged) oil leak.
Where there's smoke......

Since the valve cover was off recently, I'd now want to look higher up on the engine to see if they didn't install the valve cover gasket correctly.  Also check that pesky Cam Sensor on the right side of the motor.....that can and will leak all the way down to the bottom if unchecked.

Steady wind turbulence at speed will push leaking oil all over the bike.....best to start fresh, and closely monitor possible leak sites.

gr
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Offline Kreton'sLC

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2019, 02:17:55 pm »


I'm oft suspicious of "charity" work by dealerships, because there is NO SUCH thing in the service world.
I'd go back over the invoice to see if the oil change was part of the overall service quotation, and if the parts (oil/filter/crush washer) were literally annotated in the parts section.

Why you ask?
Well, now you have a "free" oil change on your bike that you didn't necessarily ask for, and now you have an (alleged) oil leak.
Where there's smoke......

Since the valve cover was off recently, I'd now want to look higher up on the engine to see if they didn't install the valve cover gasket correctly.  Also check that pesky Cam Sensor on the right side of the motor.....that can and will leak all the way down to the bottom if unchecked.

Steady wind turbulence at speed will push leaking oil all over the bike.....best to start fresh, and closely monitor possible leak sites.

gr

The oil change isn't shown on the invoice.  The only evidence I have they changed it is that there's a Kawi filter on their instead of the K&N I'd put on.
 
The  crankshaft sensor cover would've been removed for the valve check, but there's nothing on the invoice noting they replaced the O-ring for that.  That makes me think I should call the dealer about the issue.

Offline Bud

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2019, 03:59:48 pm »
Did they just check the valves and tell you they were all in spec?  There's a bunch of difference between a check and an adjustment.  If they actually did an adjustment, did you get a shim map?
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Offline Kreton'sLC

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2019, 06:54:17 pm »
Did they just check the valves and tell you they were all in spec?  There's a bunch of difference between a check and an adjustment.  If they actually did an adjustment, did you get a shim map?

They checked and found all were in spec and no adjustments were needed.  They wrote all the measurements down on a shim map I provided them.

I just removed the lower cowling and inspected the crankshaft sensor cover and surrounding area and it's dry as a bone.  I also checked the valve cover and cam position sensor area and that looked good too.  So at this point it looks like it is the oil pan gasket - unless I'm really lucky and it was just a few residual drops stemming from the loose drain plug that got flung up where I couldn't reach to wipe them off. 

Offline Bud

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #12 on: July 12, 2019, 09:35:25 pm »
If you could post the results of the valve check, I'm sure there will be many interested in seeing that.
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Offline TimR

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2019, 06:12:44 pm »
I would be very surprised if the oil pan gasket was leaking.  A leaking oil drain plug I can see. Had one my self. The cure was tightening the drain plug more than I like. I like tight but not gorilla tight. So I bought a pack of oil plug gaskets from Murph's (cheap) and stopped reusing them. So the next question is are there oil drips on he ground below after parking? This is how mine was discovered. No leaking valve cover gaskets or anything on the side of the motor. Only the drain plug was wet and after tightening it went away.
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Offline FTB530

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2019, 06:39:03 pm »
Have you made sure the washer is on the drain plug , first time I changed my oil it fell into the drain pan and I didn’t see that until I poured oil into recycle tub

Offline Kreton'sLC

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2019, 01:05:13 am »
Have you made sure the washer is on the drain plug , first time I changed my oil it fell into the drain pan and I didn’t see that until I poured oil into recycle tub

Yes on the washer.  In fact I replaced it even though the one the dealer used looked new and they're supposed to be good for 2-3 changes. And yeah, mine did the same disappearing act on my first change and it was a lot of fun fishing around for it in a drain pan full of hot oil! ;D

I just got back from a ride and noticed a drip from the drain plug AND the oil pan, so I torqued the drain plug a little more with my ancient torque wrench and am pretty sure it's in the 20-25 ft. lb. range which should be sufficient.  What's weird is that when I did my first oil change, I was alarmed at how easy the plug loosened.  It couldn't have had more than 8-10 ft. lbs. on it, yet wasn't leaking a bit.  I'm still pretty sure the oil pan is leaking though.  All bolts are tight and the location of the leak is isn't where it could be blow back from drain plug drips.  So probably will need to have the gasket replaced.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2019, 01:10:27 am by Kreton'sLC »

Offline Kreton'sLC

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2019, 10:54:26 pm »
Has anyone tried an oil additive like Lucas Oil or Blue Devil to stop a motorcycle oil pan leak?
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 12:06:27 pm by Kreton'sLC »

Offline MtnRider

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #17 on: Yesterday at 02:12:14 am »
My intuition is to say no. Hard telling what affect it could have on the clutch. But I doubt it would be positive.
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Offline Ranger Jim

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #18 on: Yesterday at 10:34:50 am »
I don't treat "suspected" leaks. If I have a leak, I find out where it is and address the problem. Throwing some kind of snake oil into your oil pan to deal with a "suspected" leak is pretty much a way of guaranteeing a problem that may or may not be connected to the "suspected" leak.
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Offline Phil

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #19 on: Yesterday at 03:14:37 pm »
Has anyone tried an oil additive like Lucas Oil or Blue Devil to stop a motorcycle oil pan leak?

I wouldn't. Find the leak. Fix it. Have you cleaned the oil from the affected area, then watched for the beginning of the leak to determine where it is actually coming from?

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #20 on: Yesterday at 07:26:40 pm »
Saw the question asked on the other forum also..

simply NEVER ADD ANYTHING IN THE CRANKCASE, THAT IS NOT PURE OIL....
you will ruin your clutch.

find, and fix the leak, there is no "band-aide"..

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Offline Kreton'sLC

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Re: Suspected oil pan leak
« Reply #21 on: Today at 12:06:07 pm »
Saw the question asked on the other forum also..

simply NEVER ADD ANYTHING IN THE CRANKCASE, THAT IS NOT PURE OIL....
you will ruin your clutch.

find, and fix the leak, there is no "band-aide"..

Thanks MOB for explaining why this would be a bad idea.  Will heed your advice.  No one had explained why it's a bad idea so I posted the question on the other forum as well.

I've read where some oils condition seals better than others, and when the dealer recently checked my valve clearances they did an oil change too.  Then a few weeks and several hundred miles later the leak appears.  So since I needed to change it anyway, yesterday I put in the Motorex full synth I've used before plus a new filter.
« Last Edit: Today at 12:49:58 pm by Kreton'sLC »