Author Topic: Yet another expensive lesson---never bought the spare fob and--you guessed it...  (Read 7395 times)

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Offline Fibbidiboo

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Yes, I am a moron...I must be because in addition to losing it, and after reading everything I could on what I am faced with I still have questions. Here's my nightmare: Bought the bike used and it came with only one fob. It is a 2011 Concours 14 and now I have lost the fob. Before I spend the grand on ECU, spare passive fob, a couple of keys, towing and programming I wonder if the key code the previous owner wrote down in the user manual will be my savior!I bought a blank main (active) fob key-- and had it cut by a locksmith using the code I gave him. When I tried it on the bags and fuel cap it slid in but did not turn. Obviously that code wasn't for the accessories locks. Do you think it is possible the code the previous owner wrote down could be for the Active fob itself? If so then can't I just order a new fob and have the code programmed?
Also, if I am forced to buy all new and the dealer has to connect the KDS3 to the new ECU to program new fobs, how does the seat get unlocked in order to replace the ECU and program the new ones? And if I do end up having to buy a new ECU will the stove key still work for bag, fuel and seat lock?
Finally, do I need to tell the dealer to not forget to program the TPMS system or is it part of the overall programming of the fobs?

I'm at my wits end trying to stave off the expense of a new ECU so any help you can provide I will be greatly appreciative. Wait a minute, apparently I've gone beyond the end of my wits since I kept putting off buying a spare fob. :'(

Offline C. Moore

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So no passive fob. Do you know how to get in touch with the PO? He may have it laying in a drawer just waiting for you. You get the seat off by unlocking it back by the left saddle bag. Pull up and back from the rear of the seat after you unlock it. Without the passive fob I think you are in for a new ECU and all that programming bit. I'm sure others will chime in though with suggestions. Good luck.
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Offline mattchewn

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Fibbidiboo,
If your stove knob key is in the FSS position you can remove it and use it to unlock the seat. If not I guess you will be needing a locksmith to break into it for you and make a key that fits at the same time.
The "key code" has absolutely NOTHING to do with the computer programming. It is only the designation for the specific cuts made on the physical key. All the locks are supposed to be keyed the same. Sounds like the wrong key code or maybe the locks have been changed due to another previously lost fob? I would try to have the dealer cut you a key by the VIN and see if that works. Will probably cost about 40$ but may save you a good chunk if it works. If not you will need a locksmith to make you a key.
Sorry for your luck,
At least you get two fobs with a new ECU! 
Matt
2018 H2 SXSE.  (FAT SXSE)
2011 GSX1250 FA
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Offline Fibbidiboo

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I know how to remove the seat but nowhere in any of the other posts did I read how to get the seat off with no keys and only a code written in the booklet. At home I always just turn the switch to "OFF", so it is frozen. I did find the previous owner and the only help he had was that he gave the dealer both fobs when he traded it in....4 years ago. Nothing about the code. So if I order everything new, it looks like I'll be standing in front of a locked up bike with a bag of stuff and no way to install it except to ... somehow rip the seat lock off ??? If the code the guy wrote in the manual was correct could it be for anything other than the bags, etc.?
I know this all falls on me but the penalty for idiocy seems a bit harsh. I do not understand why Kawasaki doesn't record key codes (and TPMS too) like they do the VIN.
Thanks for responding. Still stuck, only worse now, since it appears that just buying new parts doesn't end the run on my savings.


Offline Zarticus

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I know how to remove the seat but nowhere in any of the other posts did I read how to get the seat off with no keys and only a code written in the booklet. At home I always just turn the switch to "OFF", so it is frozen. I did find the previous owner and the only help he had was that he gave the dealer both fobs when he traded it in....4 years ago. Nothing about the code. So if I order everything new, it looks like I'll be standing in front of a locked up bike with a bag of stuff and no way to install it except to ... somehow rip the seat lock off ??? If the code the guy wrote in the manual was correct could it be for anything other than the bags, etc.?
I know this all falls on me but the penalty for idiocy seems a bit harsh. I do not understand why Kawasaki doesn't record key codes (and TPMS too) like they do the VIN.
Thanks for responding. Still stuck, only worse now, since it appears that just buying new parts doesn't end the run on my savings.
I can not tell you how many times I've had a key cut for Car/truck/house/bike that did not work when I tested it. Sometimes it needs to be tweaked with the wire wheel on the key cutter. Good chance your new key is correct but just has a small burr or cut that needs to be smoothed out a bit.  :beerchug:
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Offline mattchewn

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Jim,
Call a locksmith and let them make a key ON-SITE for the bike. That way you will have the correct key for the bags/gas cap. The simple, (harsh) fact is that you could have recorded the key "code" yourself since it is stamped right on the keys provided by Kawasaki. My KTM came with a separate plastic tag that also has the key code on it for emergencies. Since you have reminded me I am going to be recording my key codes right now! Thanks for that!
Good luck,
Matt
2018 H2 SXSE.  (FAT SXSE)
2011 GSX1250 FA
2009 Ninja 500R. (wifes')
2001 Bandit 650  (kids')

Offline freebird6

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and they made fun of me when I took the 2 fobs from my totalled 08 and had jwh25 reprogram those to the new bike.....you can never have too many.....

Offline gpd323

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You don't say where you lost the FOB, but I use the TrackR device because my wife is always misplacing her car keys. TrackR allows me to basically find out the general area and then activate the sound to zero in on it. The TILE device does the same.

TrackR has a cloud based system so even if its out of range other TrackR users  may stumble across it and let you know.

I have 3 more TrackR's and will be adding one to my FOB and other keys

« Last Edit: February 09, 2017, 06:59:36 pm by gpd323 »
Greg Downing
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Offline CW

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Yet another story to illustrate why I leave my fob in my (now non-locking) glove box at all times. And, I have strapped my mini back up fob into my side case.

My condolences to the OP...he's got a long, expensive journey ahead of him before he can ever ride his C14 again.
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Offline jwh20

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and they made fun of me when I took the 2 fobs from my totalled 08 and had jwh25 reprogram those to the new bike.....you can never have too many.....

I'm with you Tom, you can't have too many.  But the codes, whether key codes or even FOB IDs will not help you if you cannot unlock the bike to power up the KiPass ECU.  If you have no FOB you must buy an ECU/FOB combo package from Kawasaki or find a set from a wrecked bike.  I've seen these on EBAY at times.  The KiPass ECU alone will not help.  You must have it and at least one FOB to go with it.

I'll also add that both the seat lock and the luggage locks are easy to pick.  I've done it in just a couple of minutes so I am positive that a locksmith could do it in no time.  Once open they can make a key for it.

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Offline Fibbidiboo

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Now I'm getting angry. What was Kawasaki thinking when this design was instituted? Having to utilize a professional lock picker to allow the ECU to be swapped out (with its$900 replacement)?? Seems so slimy and ill conceived. Boy, if I were the marketing guru at a competitor company I would derisively shout to the world this absurdly tortuous, draconian method of key replacement. And though I will not walk away from the blame for this giant turd rolling down the hill, this company must take some responsibility by offering no assistance such as previously mentioned, by recording key codes in the computer that would always be available to the owner no matter if they are the first or 14th. Instead, one learns about it by about page 92 of the owners manual. Given the breathtaking expense to get my bike to ever start again it should be tattooed to the seat.
Next for me: go to YouTube and learn how to pick a lock in an effort to stem the tide of rapidly disappearing Benjamins from my wallet.

Thanks to all responders. I have but a scant amount of hope left that somebody out there will provide me --and all the other dopes like me--a perfectly logical, somewhat cheaper and simpler solution and end this nightmare. Shame on you Kawasaki, and though this means absolutely nothing to the suits in some Japanese city this experience coupled, with a previous problem with a jetski of theirs that I own, a problem of their making that they walked away from, and I've made my last Kawasaki purchase---unless I still need to buy more parts or labor to get this damn bike running again!

Offline old n slow

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As far as seat removal goes, this may sound silly, but on my aftermarket seat, Sargent brand, if I pound VERY hard with my fist on the passenger portion of the seat, in a slight rearward direction, while lifting up the rear of the seat slightly,  the seat will pop open. You may want to give it a try. Also, If you get under the seat, check the tool kit and its holding area for the passive fob. Dealer may have stuck it in there. Its not very big, and could easily be in there. I would look in every nook and cranny hidey hole on the bike for the passive fob.
Mike D.   

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Offline gpd323

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I lost my FOB over a bridge in CA, it went bye bye never to be found again. I stayed in Willow Creek CA for 1.5 days till my wife over nighted the spare RFID chipped one.  I purchased a new FOB only to have it stolen off my porch. I purchased another FOB and had it programmed at Kawasaki dealership for $40.

I now have all FOB's on a tether, in my pocket and the TrackR attached. I also carry the spare now on trips. I have never carried a spare key in my life on bikes, its either in the IG or in my hand, not so the FOB.

Spare key also has my side case keys and top box keys attached.

I feel your pain. The KIPASS is a PITA and not easy to get used to.



Greg Downing
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Washington State

Ride while you can.

Offline Fibbidiboo

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Well, finally, a victory of sorts! I wasn't kidding about going to YouTube to learn (one of the greatest products of the century!). I watched two videos, went out to the garage, applied the "bump" method using the key I had cut with the code left by the previous owner, and in less than one minute I had the seat off! So now I await the ECU to arrive from Partzilla. (they screwed up the order the first time by sending me the FI ECU even though I had called the sales guy back and had him confirm a FOB came with it. The FI ECU has no fob. Maybe out of a sense of pity they sold me the new ECU/FOB--21175-0730--for just over $700. List price: >$900).
The closest Kaw dealer, a mere 5 miles away, wants $105 to program the ECU; the other, 18 miles away will do it for $50. Of course he wants $150 to tow the bike to the shop. Think I can talk him in to bringing the KDS3 and his laptop and make a house call?

Offline TimR

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Too bad there isn't a COG member near by you with a motor cycle trailer.
Blue 1975 Z1B 900, Red 09 C14     I might not be perfect but at least I don't ride a Suzuki

Offline Zarticus

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Too bad there isn't a COG member near by you with a motor cycle trailer.
Where in the south east are you located ?
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Offline jwh20

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It's easy to blame the manufacturer, Kawasaki in this case, for your own mistakes but it's my opinion that the KiPass system works great and it does what it was designed to do, namely preventing unauthorized starting of the C14.  To date I have yet to hear of anyone who has found a way to circumvent the system.

That you can't access the bike after losing both of the FOBs you had in your possession, it not their fault.  Two you say?  Yes, that KiPass FOB had two independent means to start your bike, the KiPass active system and the Key Immobilizer passive system.  Since you have only the one FOB, you should have, as noted in numerous threads here and elsewhere, separated the two so that you didn't have the possibility of losing both at once. But that's all water-under-the-bridge now.  The important thing is to avoid making the same error twice.  Get a backup FOB, in fact get two.  They are inexpensive (about $25) and have them programmed when you get the new KiPass ECU installed and programmed at the dealer.

Yes, being in this situation sucks but having your bike stolen also sucks and this is a very effective theft deterrent.  The Kawasaki KiPass system is not unlike similar electronic/keyless ignition systems on cars.  I also expect that we'll see more and more of these on motorcycles in coming years.  You'll have to either get used to it or stick with "vintage" bikes in the future.
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Offline cappyg

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nO! I retired from vintage bikes!
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Offline OnlineAlias

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I taped my backup rfid to the underside of plastic cover on the tank.   If I'm really in a bind, all I need to do is find an allen wrench take that cover off and I'm back in business.

Offline TimR

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I don't think my 09 was 6 mos old when No Fob Bob taught me not to loose my FOB. (09 Bun Cooler) Today my wife knows where the spare FOB is and if I loose one she can overnight the spare while I sit in the bar waiting for the package to arrive.

I have to ask you though Jim where do you think you lost the FOB? 
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Offline CW

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I taped my backup rfid to the underside of plastic cover on the tank.   If I'm really in a bind, all I need to do is find an allen wrench take that cover off and I'm back in business.

GREAT IDEA!!!  I think I'll put mine there, instead of in the side case. But then again, the side case is always accessible with my seat/gas cap/case key, which I JB Welded to a radio knob, that lives in my seat lock.

Anyhow, Kim-Pass is nothing more than a solution in search of a problem for many owners. For others who want or need the assumed extra theft deterrence that it provides, I suppose Kim-Pass is great. But as for me, it is a totally unnecessary annoyance that requires a work-around to suit many owners' needs and preferences. Plus, as the OP will attest, the penalty for losing your fob is substantial, inordinately so for the questionable benefit it provides.
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Offline BiggusDekkus

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Thanks to Fibbidiboo for providing a reminder to be prepared and always have a second FOB!!  Here's what I did to avoid ever being in that situation:
1.  I had a locksmith make several extra keys for me.  Then, the stove knob always stays in the bike.  I keep one key on my key chain, one in a safe box at home, and one to give a friend when going on a longer ride.
2.  When I purchased the bike, I purchased a second FOB and got it programmed for my bike.  Then I wrote down both FOB numbers in the owners manual.
3.  The immobilizer (the small non-electronic keychain device) stays under the seat inside my tool pouch.  If the FOB is ever lost, at least I can use the key to access the immobilizer and get the bike started.
4.  The primary electronic FOB is attached to a clip which attaches inside the pocket of my jacket.  The second electronic FOB stays at home, unless I'm going on a longer ride and someone else is along who carries the second FOB.

Fibbidiboo, sorry to hear you are disenchanted with Kawasaki.  I have owned three Kawasaki motorcycles and three JetSkis, all of them have been very reliable.  Personally, I like KIPASS after using it for a while.  Much better than fumbling to find keys in your pocket with gloves on.
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Offline ZG

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When I had my Connie I took pics of the codes on the fob packaging so that I would always have it, good cheap backup.
BAD A$$ isn't cheap, and cheap isn't BAD A$$...

Offline mattchewn

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Boy, if I were the marketing guru at a competitor company I would derisively shout to the world this absurdly tortuous, draconian method of key replacement. And though I will not walk away from the blame for this giant turd rolling down the hill, this company must take some responsibility by offering no assistance such as previously mentioned, by recording key codes in the computer that would always be available to the owner no matter if they are the first or 14th.

Actually,
Kawasaki DOES record the key code. I have proof as I just got it from my dealer today. You could have gotten the "original key code from them and had a key cut to that code. This does not mean that someone hasn't replaced the locks though.
Matt
I got my warranty paperwork today to check on the transfer of the warranty. Right on the front page was the warranty terms and in bold letters was the KEY CODE!
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Offline gsun

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Writing down the codes from the packaging won't do you any good if you lose the FOB. It is specific to that FOB. And it's gone. Away. Never to return.

Sorry to hear about your situation but you say you want to have the ECU accessible if you lose your key. It would also be accessible to anyone that wanted to get at it. That's why it's locked away under the seat. I am happy with the system (so far) as nobody can steal the bike without picking it up and carrying it away. I only got one FOB with the bike and right away got two more. I carry two (one passive) on long trips in different parts of my gear. Figure I won't lose my jacket and pants at the same time!