Author Topic: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?  (Read 15247 times)

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Offline connie_rider

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #175 on: December 29, 2017, 12:46:23 am »
Other than finding a used 4 into 1 Muzzy, these are the options I know of, that are relatively EZ and inexpensive...

2006 - 2007 ZX-14 header. (has 2" ports and "no" Cat)  {Probably the best option}
Block left port, build spacer that increases OD of header to 2 1/8" OD., install your existing slip-on on the right.  {ZG Slip-on is 2 1/8" ID.} 
Done........

2008 - 2011 ZX-14 header. (has 2 1/8" ports and Cat) {Probably the next best option}
Block left port, install your existing slip-on on the right.  {ZG Slip-on is 2 1/8" ID.}
Done........

2012 - 2014 ZX-14R header. (has 2 1/8" ports and "No" Cat)
Block left port, install your existing slip-on on the right.  {ZG Slip-on is 2 1/8" ID.}
Done........

2015 - 2017 ZX-14R header. (has 2 1/8" ports and Cat)
Block left port, install your existing slip-on on the right.  {ZG Slip-on is 2 1/8" ID.}
Done........

Will any of these improve Torque/HP?
       I'm NOT sure.
But, each will; Replace our stock header and allow us to run the slip-on's we already have.

Ride safe, Ted
« Last Edit: December 29, 2017, 12:51:53 am by connie_rider »
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Offline Grant

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #176 on: December 29, 2017, 05:38:33 am »
OMG where have I been there is a crap load of reading here for me to catch up on. Dam Ted how did I miss this???
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #177 on: December 29, 2017, 05:32:23 pm »
Grant, do a quick read; The discussion started with questions about the 2012 ZX-14R exhaust I purchased.
                                   Later it moved thru various idea's I was contemplating.
                                   Lots of folks chipped in with their thoughts...

Pretty interesting reading if your a mad scientist..   >:D

I later opted to use a 2007 ZX-14 header {as the head pipes and exhaust ports are smaller, plus the head pipes are
    paired like a Concours}
.
       ZX-14R; Cyls 1/2 and 3/4 are paired.
       ZG and ZX-14; Cyls 1/4 and 2/3 are paired.

NOTE:
   The Concours Exhaust is basically a "Tri Y".   {4 - 2 - 1} {*because of the Cat design in the collector}
                       {at the end of the collector it has 1 ea (2 1/8" OD) exhaust port}.
                **I think the Cat, keeps the cylinder flows paired until they reach the end of the collector.

     The 2007 ZX-14 Exhaust is a modified "Tri Y".  {4 - 2 - 1 - 2} (*because it's collector has a dividing plate inside}
                       {at the end of the collector it has 2 ea. (2" OD) exhaust ports}.
                **I think the plate keeps the cylinder flows paired until they reach the end of the collector.
     
(Over engineering it further)
   I'm planning to use the 2007 ZX-14 headers with a valve installed in the left exhaust pipe {to make the left exhaust flow variable}...

Ride safe, Ted
« Last Edit: December 29, 2017, 08:03:38 pm by connie_rider »
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #179 on: January 20, 2018, 05:50:55 pm »
Thanks Gary. I considered an electric dump valve but wanted something to operate with the exhaust flow, not just open or closed.
You and I were talking about an EXUP system somewhere about the 3rd page of this discussion.
An EXUP is kinda/sorta what I'm working at..

I purchased a Stainless Steel valve some time ago.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vacuum-Activated-Exhaust-Cutout-2-51MM-Open-Style-Pressure-about-1-BAR/252934027007?epid=869869096&hash=item3ae40af6ff:g:yeoAAOSw~FJZFWG~

Since that time, I removed the vacuum mechanism, and machined and welded adapters to the valve.
  {The adapters make installation between the header and the mid pipe EZ to do, and changes overall length only 2".}
I've purchased Muzzy Slip-on's, and built a muffler hanger for the left side of the bike.
Bouht gaskets, side stand, hardware, etc..

Headers;
I decided the ZX-14R headers were bad for a ZG-1400, and purchased early (non-cat) ZX-14 headers.
  { ZX-14R head pipes are too big, cylinder phasing of the head pipes is incorrect, Exhaust ports are 2 1/8"}
  {Early ZX-14 headers have smaller head pipe diameters, correct cylinder phasing, and 2" exhaust ports}

I think everything is almost ready..

Right now, I'm waiting to see dyno plots/numbers on a ZX-14 header and slip-on's.
                 (Ivan is supposed to be doing dyno run's soon).

Ride safe, Ted
« Last Edit: January 22, 2018, 07:33:53 pm by connie_rider »
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Offline gPink

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #180 on: January 20, 2018, 06:12:19 pm »
You mention exhaust flow controlled which would correlate with rpms and throttle position. Could you get Steve to tie it to the ecu to control a stepper motor like the secondary butterflies are controlled?

Offline Grant

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #181 on: January 20, 2018, 07:15:24 pm »
You mention exhaust flow controlled which would correlate with rpms and throttle position. Could you get Steve to tie it to the ecu to control a stepper motor like the secondary butterflies are controlled?

Thanks Gary. I considered an electric dump valve but wanted something to operate with the exhaust flow, not just open or closed.
You and I were talking about an EXUP system somewhere about the 3rd page of this discussion.
An EXUP is kinda/sorta what I'm working at..

I purchased a Stainless Steel valve some time ago.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vacuum-Activated-Exhaust-Cutout-2-51MM-Open-Style-Pressure-about-1-BAR/252934027007?epid=869869096&hash=item3ae40af6ff:g:yeoAAOSw~FJZFWG~

Since that time, I removed the vacuum mechanism, and machined and welded adapters to the valve.
  {The adapters make installation between the header and the mid pipe EZ to do, and changes overall length only 2".}
I've purchased Muzzy Slip-on's, and built a muffler hanger for the left side of the bike.
Bouht gaskets, side stand, hardware, etc..

Headers;
I decided the ZX-14R headers were bad for a ZG-1400, and purchased early (non-cat) ZX-14 headers.
  { ZX-14R head pipes are too big, cylinder phasing of the head pipes is incorrect, Exhaust ports are 2 1/8"}
  {Early ZX-14 headers have smaller head pipe diameters, correct cylinder phasing, and 2" exhaust ports}

I think everything is almost ready..

Right now, I'm waiting to see dyno plots/numbers on a ZX-14 header and slip-on's.
                 (Iam is supposed to be doing run's soon).

Ride safe, Ted
How about a vacuum sense turbo waste gate with a light weight spring? This would only allow exhaust to flow through the auxiliary exhaust when a predetermined back pressure was reached.
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Offline Grant

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #182 on: January 20, 2018, 07:30:29 pm »
I am working on a compound diesel turbo setup right  now where the high pressure turbo is a VVT and a waste gate would not typically be used. My idea is to have the waste gate installed before the high pressure turbo but dump back in before the atmospheric Turbo.
Otherwise when the little turbo is in danger of being over driven above the capabilities of the variable veins a small portion of exhaust will be routed around it but still fed through the larger Turbo and not be wasted.
I don't see why a wastegate could not be used in a non turbo exhaust to control Power Band in a system such as Ted is describing here the same way I am using it to get the Best of Both Worlds.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2018, 07:33:53 pm by Grant »
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Offline stephen_gayle

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #183 on: January 20, 2018, 10:34:36 pm »
maybe a bit late....but. yes, put the header on....might want to change out spark plugs while you  do this, easier access.  I put header on 09 c14...caped left side and stayed with single pipe.  made cap out of piece of exhaust pipe with cap welded on pipe...used local muffler shop for fab.   I also used 'wrap exhaust tape' from local auto parts store since neither exhaust donut works from c14 or zx.   hp at rear wheel remained in 150 range.   the after market pipe/muffler set up perfect for center stand bumber.     hope this helps.    Stephen in cleveland

Offline connie_rider

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #184 on: January 21, 2018, 01:02:49 am »
Thanks Stephen...  150 HP range is a realistic number, and it's what I'm hoping for.
I would love to see any dyno plots you might have??
  This project started with a ZX-14R header and 1 slip-on, later changed to a ZX-14 Header and 2 slip-on's (w/valve).
    That led to idea of opening the left port "only" when I needed the extra exhaust flow...

Gary, a stepper motor and ECU control was discussed on page 1 -3 of this discussion.
   Because of complexity, I opted to try a manual operation first.
        {to see if controlling flow thru the left aside does anything} {ie; Dyno runs}
   Most folks think it is a waste of time..... But, {because I'm hard headed} I'm still trying to get it built...

Grant your a lot more knowledgeable than I about operation of a waste gate etc.
   I think my valve is basically a poor mans waste gate.  {??}
    NOTE: One {close} side of the valve will be drilled to lessen the surface area on that side.
              Pressure/flow against the other {open} side of the valve will allow it to open.
               {I think the differential pressure will do the work, because of the difference in surface area}
              A weak spring will control the opening pressure / set point.
                    I hope........

Ride safe, Ted      <Mad Scientist Grin>  >:D
« Last Edit: February 11, 2018, 10:46:48 pm by connie_rider »
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: ZX-14 or ZX-14R Exhaust for a C-14?
« Reply #185 on: February 11, 2018, 10:50:15 pm »
We finally got a ZX-14 header plot to see.
Ivan recently tested a C-14 with ZX-14 header and developed a Flash to go with it.

http://forum.cog-online.org/ivan's-performance-products/2006-2007-zx14-header-tuned-and-tested/

Peak HP {w/flash} is shown at 159, and the mid range looks pretty good.
{for only $500+ more} An Akrapovic full system made 162 peak HP and {I think} had less low end power..

I already asked if he also had a plot of a ZX-14 header {without the flash} that we could see {for reference}...

I've been asking this exact question for 2 years. Still hoping for the plot from someone..  :banghead:

Ride safe, Ted
« Last Edit: February 15, 2018, 01:38:59 am by connie_rider »
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