Author Topic: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls  (Read 885 times)

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Offline Eric

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Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« on: December 02, 2019, 02:17:06 pm »
Hello COG,

New to forum and new owner of an 02 C10 that shows 15000 on the odometer. It starts and and runs. It came with overflow tubes and what appears to be the 2mm (foam restrictor in air box). Unfortunately the owner took off air box (with KN filter) and put on pods.  In the carburetor antics that followed it appears he undid SISF's jetting work replacing everything except the pilots and emulsion tubes. (I think) I also believe I have the original jiblets that were swapped out and after a quick discussion with SISF it appears they are the remnants of his jetting goodies.  SO...Steve will put it right (again) for a reasonable fee.  However, me being me, I want to see if the old jiblets can be re inserted and see if I can make it live again on my own. If not I already have the box and bubble wrap for the carbs that can go back to the mad scientist in Sunny Florida for resurrection to their former wickedness.  I should add the bike passes the hydrolock test.
Now here's the question after all that run up.   When I look at the float bowls they appear to be two different geometries.  I noticed that when I  put the drain plugs back in after cleaning the carbs, two plugs seated into the carbs flush with the exterior of the bowl and two left about a 1/4 in proud after seated. I have tried to search to see if this is normal...or if it matters since bike runs/ran with the bowls. I am waiting for my repair manuals to arrive but thought I would see what members might think.  Thanks everyone.  Love the board.






 





Offline bajasam

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2019, 02:24:15 pm »
Carbs are'nt universal fit, they are position specific.

Offline m in sc

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2019, 02:26:32 pm »
you're right about the drain screws, mine and my buddys were the same way, so i'd assume its normal. why they recessed 2 and had 2 protrude is beyond me. 
I break stuff. I fix stuff. (rinse & repeat as necessary)

Offline Eric

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2019, 02:42:59 pm »
Good to know. I'm gonna remount carbs and see what happens.  Thanks M.




Online crag antler

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2019, 03:37:52 pm »
Eric, you’ve made your right move with contacting Steve.
He is truly the guru of our carbs. Got mine back from him a month or so
and she runs better than she ever did over the 13 years we’ve been together.
What your location? There’s plenty of Coggers in the Southeast.
Doug aka crag antler
00 Kawasaki Concours 60,000+ miles. Bafflectomy,Bar risers, Murphs kneesavers, blockoff plates, allen head screw set,headlight upgrade. LED headlight, driving lights, free power mod, JC Whitney trunk, Go Pro mount,’06 header w/Jet-Hot ceramic coating, over flow tubes, 2 minute mod, carb spa and Performance Exhaust Sprocket by SISF

Offline Eric

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2019, 04:16:01 pm »
I'm located in beautiful Cortez, FL.  I fully suspect Steve will need to go through the carbs. (again).  I just want to see what happens when I try to put it back into shape from where I got it.  Another thing, I don't know for example, whether the exhaust cam replacement was done. I assume that may impact the carb set up , I don't know how Steve works the magic I hear of.  So  I guess when I open her up to do the valve adjustment, Ill see.  I'm not wishing anything bad on Steve, by no means. But who's going to carry his important work forward?  Maybe we could get a seminar from him or something.  I mean, , sure there's a ton of info floating out there between his site, this site and a few others, but maybe he could write it all down and seal it in a time capsule to be opened upon his relocation to the Sunny beyond.  Just thinking out loud. Looking forward to meeting my neighbors wherever they are.  Where exactly are you located? 






Offline connie_rider

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2019, 05:13:38 pm »
Why do you think it need an exhaust cam replacement?

Ride safe, Ted
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Offline Bud

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2019, 08:23:24 pm »
Why do you think it need an exhaust cam replacement?

Ride safe, Ted
I think he means he doesn't know if it has Steve's torque cams or the modded sprocket offered by Steve.  Are there any marks that Steve puts on the torque cams for ID purposes?
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2019, 08:55:09 pm »
you're right about the drain screws, mine and my buddys were the same way, so i'd assume its normal. why they recessed 2 and had 2 protrude is beyond me.

the carb history on this bike shows early and later screw differences:

the "original" drain screw config, was the longer screw, with the addition of an o-ring on it's barrel,
from '86 to later, this was and is the current available setup, drain screw was 92009-1487, with o ring 92055-1053.
all 4 carbs on bike as delivered, had the same screw, and they were never delivered with alternate screws on the same bike.
The bowls remained un changed from '86 thru '06, L/H bowls were 16020-1055, and R/H bowls were 16020-1054...

On carbs with the "shorter screws", the screw was 92009-1551, and did not utilize the o-ring on it's barrel.
I can't say for certain exactly when that screw "appeared", and as it makes no difference in it's function, because the actual "sealing" is done by the taper on the end of the screw, they just did away with the O-ring, and shortened the length, as it didn't need to be so long, after they dropped the o-ring.

so, again, from the factory as delivered, whichever screws were used, were used in multiple of 4, not 2 of each..

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Offline m in sc

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #9 on: December 02, 2019, 09:12:15 pm »
they show both on a 99 fiche. I disagree. 2 dead stock unmolested bikes , my 99 and Toms 2000 had the same anomaly i've seen 1st hand





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Online crag antler

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2019, 09:34:15 pm »
I'm located in beautiful Cortez.
Where exactly are you located?
Eric, I’m up in Western NC, between Asheville NC and the SC border.
Born and raised on the Space Coast😎
Doug aka crag antler
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #11 on: December 02, 2019, 09:58:56 pm »
they show both on a 99 fiche. I disagree. 2 dead stock unmolested bikes , my 99 and Toms 2000 had the same anomaly i've seen 1st hand




well, I guess your bikes were special...  :great: :great: (just joking, in a friendly manner)
did you look at the quantity per bike, listed down by the complete part number? I guess that part isn't important.
I use the Kawasaki parts diagrams my self, and it shows the same... pictorially... and I understand the difference, and why they showed both. The attached snip of the quantities I placed below, shows a qty of 4, for both..

no problem, I stand by my explanation.  If you do a "where used" for the -1551 screw, you will find it only applied (appeared) from the '95 (A10 model) to present..
Doing the same where used search, for the -1487 screw (the long one, with the o-ring) , shows it can be applied to every model year....

but wait.... here's the funniest part..... :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:
-1487 is now obsoleted, and has been changed to -1095.... which doesn't show a where used for any C10 model... :-X :truce: :truce:
« Last Edit: December 02, 2019, 10:28:34 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

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Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2019, 11:05:26 pm »
  I'm not wishing anything bad on Steve... maybe he could write it all down and seal it in a time capsule to be opened upon his relocation to the Sunny beyond. 

   Forget the carbs... I'm still trying to get over THIS part ^^^ . :??: :??: :??: 

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Offline m in sc

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #13 on: December 03, 2019, 12:01:35 am »
i saw the qty call out. I have no idea there. however, when i did my own drain tubes, i bought a set off of ebay. never used them because i luckily didn't screw up. these are the 4 i got from the same seller, just took this pic in the box in the garage.

Im not being argumentative, but thats 4 bikes that had this. the ops, mine, toms, and a random ebay seller. that can't be a coincidence.

does it really matter? nope. but it seems to be 'normal' on some.




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Offline Eric

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #14 on: December 03, 2019, 12:12:49 am »
  I'm not wishing anything bad on Steve... maybe he could write it all down and seal it in a time capsule to be opened upon his relocation to the Sunny beyond. 

   Forget the carbs... I'm still trying to get over THIS part ^^^ . :??: :??: :??: 

   "the not dead yet" Steve

Dear Un-dead Steve,

Too funny.   All I'm saying is that it only takes about a minute browsing this site to see that what you have in your head as to knowledge about this bike needs to be preserved for future generations.  Live long and prosper, I will be gone long before you, but I think it would be a shame to loose everything you bring.  Time to write a book...put me down for the first copy.

Offline Eric

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #15 on: December 03, 2019, 12:20:59 am »
Thanks everyone for the responses.  I can just picture the Kaw engineers who thought  we would never figure out they were using a back inventory of old  Ninja float bowls or whatever.  I was worried that the prior owner had done something weird with the bowls like he did with un-dead Steve's jetting.  Thanks for putting my mind at ease. 

Offline Eric

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #16 on: December 03, 2019, 12:27:17 am »
Why do you think it need an exhaust cam replacement?

Ride safe, Ted

Ted, just seemed to me to be the right thing to do if I was back into re jetting.  Again, I don't know what Steve does and how it may impact his process for jetting if I am going to do the top end work anyway. 

Offline connieklr

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #17 on: December 03, 2019, 12:30:16 am »
you're right about the drain screws, mine and my buddys were the same way, so i'd assume its normal. why they recessed 2 and had 2 protrude is beyond me.

the carb history on this bike shows early and later screw differences:

the "original" drain screw config, was the longer screw, with the addition of an o-ring on it's barrel,
from '86 to later, this was and is the current available setup, drain screw was 92009-1487, with o ring 92055-1053.
all 4 carbs on bike as delivered, had the same screw, and they were never delivered with alternate screws on the same bike.
The bowls remained un changed from '86 thru '06, L/H bowls were 16020-1055, and R/H bowls were 16020-1054...

On carbs with the "shorter screws", the screw was 92009-1551, and did not utilize the o-ring on it's barrel.
I can't say for certain exactly when that screw "appeared", and as it makes no difference in it's function, because the actual "sealing" is done by the taper on the end of the screw, they just did away with the O-ring, and shortened the length, as it didn't need to be so long, after they dropped the o-ring.

so, again, from the factory as delivered, whichever screws were used, were used in multiple of 4, not 2 of each..

The OEM drain screws on my '95 are different. Two short, and two long.
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Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #18 on: December 03, 2019, 01:44:16 am »
The drain screws in all cases are the same length as each other given the year, etc. in other words the 5mm hex used from 86 to 88 are the all the same length. then they switched to 3mm with a different thread pitch and no oring. that was about 89 to 93. By 94 they had the same small head 3mm drain screws. all the scres are the same length, but how far they sink into the bowls in different. Each carb rack has 2 left and 2 right, and one side DOES sit flush with the bowl whilethe other side is proud by maybe 3/16".

  And I'm still not dead, but I'm working on it.

  Steve
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Offline JPD

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #19 on: December 03, 2019, 02:47:17 am »
The drain screws in all cases are the same length as each other given the year, etc. in other words the 5mm hex used from 86 to 88 are the all the same length. then they switched to 3mm with a different thread pitch and no oring. that was about 89 to 93. By 94 they had the same small head 3mm drain screws. all the scres are the same length, but how far they sink into the bowls in different. Each carb rack has 2 left and 2 right, and one side DOES sit flush with the bowl whilethe other side is proud by maybe 3/16".

  And I'm still not dead, but I'm working on it.

  Steve

My bikes have drain screws that look to be different lengths. I have not removed them to measure them. Info from MOB and Steve say they are the same. They just look different to us novices.

I am thankful to have this knowledge base here, and so willing to share.

Offline m in sc

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #20 on: December 03, 2019, 03:53:24 am »
well the casting is for some reason different on the bowls themselves. is what it is. Im sure the screws are the same.
I break stuff. I fix stuff. (rinse & repeat as necessary)

Offline connie_rider

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #21 on: December 03, 2019, 01:36:33 pm »
The drain screws in all cases are the same length as each other given the year, etc. in other words the 5mm hex used from 86 to 88 are the all the same length. then they switched to 3mm with a different thread pitch and no oring. that was about 89 to 93. By 94 they had the same small head 3mm drain screws. all the scres are the same length, but how far they sink into the bowls in different. Each carb rack has 2 left and 2 right, and one side DOES sit flush with the bowl whilethe other side is proud by maybe 3/16".

  And I'm still not dead, but I'm working on it.

  Steve

You can't die on us!!! Your one of us!!!
Besides,, your too old and crotchety to die..

Ride safe, Ted
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Help us make "OtP" possible again!!

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #22 on: December 03, 2019, 03:56:58 pm »
well the casting is for some reason different on the bowls themselves. is what it is. Im sure the screws are the same.

 :-[ :great: :great: :great: :great:

BINGO.....

the Lefty bowls and Righty bowls, differ in the casting as can be seen in your photo... more so then just "left or right" facing... I was pounding my forehead until I looked at that photo, because I know how many times I've pulled carbs apart, and tossed pieces in bins... and I knew I didn't need to worry 'which screw' I picked up when putting another set together... dummy me....

Eric... Ninja bowls are different than Connie bowls... so rule that part out.... :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

Thanks everyone for the responses. I can just picture the Kaw engineers who thought  we would never figure out they were using a back inventory of old  Ninja float bowls or whatever.  I was worried that the prior owner had done something weird with the bowls like he did with un-dead Steve's jetting.  Thanks for putting my mind at ease.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2019, 04:00:01 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

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and if you are gonna call me names... it's MR. Analdweeb if you please...

Offline Eric

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #23 on: December 03, 2019, 04:44:37 pm »
Roger that on the Ninja bowls. Perhaps they were intentionally  screwing with us.  Some kinda Japanese humor?

Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: Carburetor resurrection and float bowls
« Reply #24 on: December 03, 2019, 05:10:55 pm »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBxMPqxJGqI

   "I'm not dead yet" Steve
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C-10 Carb work , cams, & performance enhancements
 " Modifications for sport-tourers, BY a sport-tourer"
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