Author Topic: Coolant Leak Help  (Read 1835 times)

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Offline DC Concours

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2018, 05:12:08 pm »
Mine didn't come with a tie. Perhaps it broke (heat damage) and fell off. How important is this tie? And which coolant hose is it keeping away from the exhaust pipes?




that hose MUST be tie wrapped to the adjacent steel coolant pipe it sits next to, to prevent it from touching the header... like in this picture below.

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2018, 07:13:37 pm »
Mine didn't come with a tie. Perhaps it broke (heat damage) and fell off. How important is this tie? And which coolant hose is it keeping away from the exhaust pipes?




that hose MUST be tie wrapped to the adjacent steel coolant pipe it sits next to, to prevent it from touching the header... like in this picture below.

You can see it in the picture in post #15
it ties the 2 metal tubes together, behind the exhaust, on the line from the w/p forwards..
if the zip tie is missing, the tubes tend to migrate towards the header, and depending on how much, can actually touch, and melt the hose.... It's also shown in the FSM, and they make a point of noting it be tied off between the 2 hose/tube runs.
the picture below shows the tubes from below the bike,(note, this is from BELOW the bike, looking up, with the camera on the floor...) to clarify further...
« Last Edit: November 28, 2018, 07:17:22 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

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Offline Mcfly

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2018, 07:29:56 pm »
If you have all the plastic off, look at the cooling hose by the #2 header. It gets cooked from the heat and leaks. I did all the hoses on my  99 last spring, along with the logs and thermostat.
Not sure if you can get to the thermostat with the carbs. on. I think I looked at it several years ago and decided to wait until it leaked or the carbs. were off for other maintenance.

I was able to access the thermostat without removing the carbs.  I removed it when upgrading to a Thermo-bob...  Just be careful,
if you go in ham-fisted, you'll likely end up causing another leak.  I did all of my hoses on my '06 with carbs in...  The o-rings were not
as cooperative.  Carb removal is THAT bad...  (unless you have cruise control :()  Worst hose is the one behind the exhaust manifold.
ACK! What a PITA!  Still doable though.  Worth the piece of mind.
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Offline Victor Salisbury

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2018, 08:04:17 pm »
Replacing the top bolts of the thermostat housing with allens makes later removal of the top cover easier. Not a snap, just easier. HTH

I used an 8mm GearWrench ratchet wrench on mine, worked like a champ.
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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2018, 08:16:10 pm »
Replacing the top bolts of the thermostat housing with allens makes later removal of the top cover easier. Not a snap, just easier. HTH

I used an 8mm GearWrench ratchet wrench on mine, worked like a champ. The final threads had to finger loosen the bolt and remove.

I have a set of those now... very handy...
didn't have them when I did the article, or back '04/'05 when I attempted the "shortcut method"... which ended up in finally removing the carbs, after 3 failed o-ring attempts (rings rolled during installation) on the rear log... thus my hatred for "the shortcut method", which ended up in a 4-5 hour cluster fubar, a lot of wasted coolant, and sore fingers.

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Offline DC Concours

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #30 on: November 28, 2018, 08:28:11 pm »
That front pic is great. Thank you. Now I see the other pipe in concern.

How tight do I tie them together? As tight as I can till the 2 coolant pipes touch? My pipes seem to have a lot of play and I don't want to cause a leak from them being too skewed. I sometimes get a small coolant leak in that area as it is.




You can see it in the picture in post #15
it ties the 2 metal tubes together, behind the exhaust, on the line from the w/p forwards..
if the zip tie is missing, the tubes tend to migrate towards the header, and depending on how much, can actually touch, and melt the hose.... It's also shown in the FSM, and they make a point of noting it be tied off between the 2 hose/tube runs.
the picture below shows the tubes from below the bike,(note, this is from BELOW the bike, looking up, with the camera on the floor...) to clarify further...

Offline Mcfly

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #31 on: November 28, 2018, 09:15:08 pm »
That front pic is great. Thank you. Now I see the other pipe in concern.

How tight do I tie them together? As tight as I can till the 2 coolant pipes touch? My pipes seem to have a lot of play and I don't want to cause a leak from them being too skewed. I sometimes get a small coolant leak in that area as it is.




You can see it in the picture in post #15
it ties the 2 metal tubes together, behind the exhaust, on the line from the w/p forwards..
if the zip tie is missing, the tubes tend to migrate towards the header, and depending on how much, can actually touch, and melt the hose.... It's also shown in the FSM, and they make a point of noting it be tied off between the 2 hose/tube runs.
the picture below shows the tubes from below the bike,(note, this is from BELOW the bike, looking up, with the camera on the floor...) to clarify further...

You're going to zip tie the two pipes (non rubber hoses)  pull the tie until the hoses are close togther. If they're 'loose' trace them back towards the
Engine.  Make sure the retaining bolt is tight... if not, put a dab of thread locker on it, and tighten it down.  Mine lost the bolt and popped at the nationals.
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Online MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #32 on: November 28, 2018, 11:23:52 pm »
That front pic is great. Thank you. Now I see the other pipe in concern.

How tight do I tie them together? As tight as I can till the 2 coolant pipes touch? My pipes seem to have a lot of play and I don't want to cause a leak from them being too skewed. I sometimes get a small coolant leak in that area as it is.




You can see it in the picture in post #15
it ties the 2 metal tubes together, behind the exhaust, on the line from the w/p forwards..
if the zip tie is missing, the tubes tend to migrate towards the header, and depending on how much, can actually touch, and melt the hose.... It's also shown in the FSM, and they make a point of noting it be tied off between the 2 hose/tube runs.
the picture below shows the tubes from below the bike,(note, this is from BELOW the bike, looking up, with the camera on the floor...) to clarify further...

I always zip the tie to make both touch,(the hose part on the pipe will be tight against the other tube), and I do it before tightening the hose clamp on the rubber hose, going to the w/p. then I tighten the hose clamp. I think it's important to mention that when working with any of the "o-ring" connections, like the pipe to w/p junction, moving them around years after they been connected, usually is followed by a leaker, requiring removal, scrubbing abrasively the metal parts, polishing them with a ScotchBrite, and installing a new ring. I don't use LokTite on stuff like those bolts either, people get to crazy and use it everywhere, simply smearing some black RTV on the bolt before tightening it up, provides ample protection against them loosening. And doesn't require worried efforts when you need to remove those bolts..

When I do replace hoses, after cleaning and scrubbing any oxides from the metal the hose slips on to, I also smear a light coating of grease, to assist the process, prevent further corrosion, and keep the rubber somewhat pliable... this is the perfect place for people to "use up" all that "dielectric silicone based grease" because they bought it and just have to use it.
 :)) :great: :beerchug: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #33 on: November 29, 2018, 11:11:30 am »
The large o-ring at the top of my '95's thermostat housing eventually disintegrated a number of years ago, but I didn’t know it; it never leaked any fluid. What it did leak was air…… “vacuum air” to be more specific when the bike was cooling down. Coolant that had expanded and made its way to the reservoir during normal operation was not coming back up into the radiator and the rest of the system. The leak caused by the fooked o-ring prevented a “draw” on the system to get the fluid back up into place. Consequently, the radiator was always low on coolant.

This came to light during a burn down to Daytona (Port Orange) for dinner one year with a COG group, then an immediate run back home. Stop and go traffic in the FL heat first brought the problem to light, and I had to periodically add water on the run home during gas stops. Took me awhile in the following days to figure it out, but once I did, the (now non-existent) o-ring got replaced and all was good in River City.

And yes, you can pull the thermostat housing with the carbs in place. Had to do that to a Maryland member’s bike in the motel parking lot out at the CO National in 2002. The bolt in the bottom of the housing fell out and the housing dislodged by pressure. The oval cross-sectioned o-ring had become distorted through all this and we couldn’t get that one back in place, but got a suitable replacement at a John Deere place. Fortunately, the bolt stayed in behind the cylinders, but lord what a PITA to get it back up in place, started, and then tightened. Took a combination of ¼” ratchet, ¼ to 3/8 adapters, short extension sections, and lots of patience. The carb clamps tore the crap out of my one hand, but it got done and held for the rest of the trip, and until he finally got rid of the bike last year.
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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #34 on: November 29, 2018, 01:59:55 pm »
Got the parts from Murphy in the mail and now ready to at least replace the leaky hose, at least for now.

Any specific procedure or tip to drain the coolant just enough to remove the top coolant hose? Preferred location to drain?

Thanks in advance!
BB
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Offline Mike

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #35 on: November 29, 2018, 05:26:52 pm »
Got the parts from Murphy in the mail and now ready to at least replace the leaky hose, at least for now.

Any specific procedure or tip to drain the coolant just enough to remove the top coolant hose? Preferred location to drain?

Thanks in advance!
BB
There's probably nothing left in the hose since it's at the top of the system. I'd just R&R the hose. Top off the system and reservoir (which you can do thru the overflow hose).

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #36 on: November 29, 2018, 09:15:04 pm »
Got the parts from Murphy in the mail and now ready to at least replace the leaky hose, at least for now.

Any specific procedure or tip to drain the coolant just enough to remove the top coolant hose? Preferred location to drain?

Thanks in advance!
BB
There's probably nothing left in the hose since it's at the top of the system. I'd just R&R the hose. Top off the system and reservoir (which you can do thru the overflow hose).

I don't grasp what Mike is attempting to explain about using the overflow hose, while that works fine on a C14, it isn't the method for use on a C10, which has easy access to the radiator and overflow catch jug...( if you do check the coolant in the jug, remove the cap, stick your finger in, and if your finger tip hits coolant, it's good... don't over fill it...it'll just be spewed back out and thru the hose that dumps it by the rear wheel...)


there is a coolant drain bolt/plug in the bottom of the steel pipe that attaches to the waterpump, down under... takes an 11mm (7/16") wrench for bolt head.
see photo 1 below...

as for filling, you ain't draining the overflow tank, so you just fill thru the radiator cap from top... maybe burp the system by attaching a hose to the bleeder fitting on the thermo housing, and running a hose back into the open filler cap as it warms up, and then shut the bleeder, and cap it off... if you do completely drain the system, loosen the bleeder bolt on the water pump,while holding a rag under it, and any lower air is expelled, be ready to retighten that bolt fast.. (done before starting the engine).
Its the upper one, on the left, in the second photo below.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2018, 09:21:18 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #37 on: November 29, 2018, 10:16:04 pm »
Uh, the burp bolt is the one on the left. The one on the right is a water pump housing bolt.

A second burp bolt looks like a brake bleeder and is up on the thermostat housing cover.
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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #38 on: November 30, 2018, 03:25:34 am »
 :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :))

yeah

..... maybe burp the system by attaching a hose to the bleeder fitting on the thermo housing, and running a hose back into the open filler cap as it warms up, and then shut the bleeder, and cap it off...

if you do completely drain the system, loosen the bleeder bolt on the water pump,while holding a rag under it, and any lower air is expelled, be ready to retighten that bolt fast.. (done before starting the engine).
Its the upper one, on the left, in the second photo below.

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Offline DC Concours

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #39 on: November 30, 2018, 04:12:51 am »
You have nice pics covering all the nooks and crannies of the bike. There should be a stickie of all your pics.

What is the function of the right bolt in the second pic that also has a white arrow pointing to it?

..... maybe burp the system by attaching a hose to the bleeder fitting on the thermo housing, and running a hose back into the open filler cap as it warms up, and then shut the bleeder, and cap it off...

if you do completely drain the system, loosen the bleeder bolt on the water pump,while holding a rag under it, and any lower air is expelled, be ready to retighten that bolt fast.. (done before starting the engine).
Its the upper one, on the left, in the second photo below.

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #40 on: November 30, 2018, 10:50:32 am »
You have nice pics covering all the nooks and crannies of the bike. There should be a stickie of all your pics.

What is the function of the right bolt in the second pic that also has a white arrow pointing to it?

..... maybe burp the system by attaching a hose to the bleeder fitting on the thermo housing, and running a hose back into the open filler cap as it warms up, and then shut the bleeder, and cap it off...

if you do completely drain the system, loosen the bleeder bolt on the water pump,while holding a rag under it, and any lower air is expelled, be ready to retighten that bolt fast.. (done before starting the engine).
Its the upper one, on the left, in the second photo below.

READ 2 posts up.
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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #41 on: November 30, 2018, 09:07:38 pm »
You have nice pics covering all the nooks and crannies of the bike. There should be a stickie of all your pics.



thanks
many of them are parts of Tech Articles I wrote in the Concourier.
Guy also provided many useful pictures and articles in the same manner, over a longer period of time than I did.

these are found in the COG library, and can be read anytime, but access to those books is limited to COG members, just like the Quarterly Publication.
sorry
 :truce:

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #42 on: December 01, 2018, 02:35:59 am »
I like working on this bike, i can understand how easy it is to get hooked on it.

i was able to check motor mounts, stem bearing, coils & cables (previous owner installed E3 plugs which I couldnt remove to inspect because different socket), clean K&N and replace a busted hose!

Put the tank back together and the machine run beautifully again. Went thru an entire fan cycle, all good.

The only thing i was not able to find, besides a few broken fairing tabs (  :'( ) was the infamous air vent scoop which i hear it goes by the valve cover in front on the engine.

If i were to find the correct name for this piece  :-[ :-[ and buy it on Ebay, would be possible to install it just removing  the tank?

 :beerchug: :beerchug:


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Offline Bob_C_CT

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #43 on: December 01, 2018, 07:39:48 am »
Hi BB, here is a picture of the valve cover heat shield under reply#20 in the following post.

http://forum.cog-online.org/accessories-c10/vent-flaps-for-engine-heat/msg595624/#msg595624

See if you can take a look from the same vantage point as the picture to see if that shield is there.

You may want to start a separate post on this question if you don't get response here, not sure what the exact terminology of that shield is but should be called out in the manual.

I got to meet BB and he is a good guy and eager to wrench on his bikes. The 99 he has looks good and PO had added some good add ons. Ceramic coated exhaust from the headers back to the muffler cans connection caught my eye.

Glad you fixed the slightly leaking hose, that could of ended up a trip stopper upon full failure.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2018, 12:51:31 pm by Bob_C_CT »
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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #44 on: December 01, 2018, 09:32:26 pm »
I wouldn't be to worried about finding a deflector, as I see you are in the Northeast...

if you were in an extremely hot climate, maybe, but the part is more of a p.i.t.a. to keep in place during a valve check, than the benefits it provides...

it's p/n

14024-1267   COVER
92093-1214   SEAL
and 2 rubber bits that hold it in place by friction
92075-1446   DAMPER   2pcs

seriously, I wouldn't search one down, the engine will have better airflow "up top" without it... :motonoises:

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #45 on: December 01, 2018, 10:09:32 pm »
I wouldn't be to worried about finding a deflector, as I see you are in the Northeast...

if you were in an extremely hot climate, maybe, but the part is more of a p.i.t.a. to keep in place during a valve check, than the benefits it provides...

it's p/n

14024-1267   COVER
92093-1214   SEAL
and 2 rubber bits that hold it in place by friction
92075-1446   DAMPER   2pcs

seriously, I wouldn't search one down, the engine will have better airflow "up top" without it... :motonoises:

To what gain?

IMHO - it's main benefit is "deflecting" a lot of the road crap thrown up by the front wheel and keeps it from collecting on top of the valve cover. Not really a PITA during valve adjustments either. Just disengage it's two catches and push the backside down below the lip where the valve cover sits on top of the cylinder head. When done and you've checked for oil leaks, pop it back up into place and re-engage the two catches.
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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #46 on: December 02, 2018, 12:40:22 am »
I wouldn't be to worried about finding a deflector, as I see you are in the Northeast...
14024-1267   COVER
92093-1214   SEAL
and 2 rubber bits that hold it in place by friction
92075-1446   DAMPER   2pcs

My friend, this bike is dreaming about going to Mexico... so any little help with heating would be awesome!

Not clear whether I can install this deflector by only removing the tank. Could you please clarify?
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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #47 on: December 02, 2018, 12:42:16 am »
Glad you fixed the slightly leaking hose, that could of ended up a trip stopper upon full failure.

Thank you for the help, very valuable! And I should be back in CT Monday/Tuesday for highway pegs and oil change and putting the Purple machine back together!

Maybe we could do a Bantam lake trip one of these weekends, unless you already retired your bike for the winter.

Cheers!
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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #48 on: December 03, 2018, 01:40:16 pm »
This busted hose found another way to be stay in the Concours family:



 :nananana: :nananana: :nananana:
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Offline SteveJ.

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Re: Coolant Leak Help
« Reply #49 on: December 09, 2018, 10:47:05 pm »
This busted hose found another way to be stay in the Concours family:



 :nananana: :nananana: :nananana:

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