Author Topic: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?  (Read 22543 times)

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Offline smithr1

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #50 on: December 20, 2013, 02:13:25 pm »
Rev - I spoke with JD yesterday, the valve he's using isn't the same as the one I tested, this one has a better flow rate, and also an unique mounting arrangement that may make it a good replacement for the factory petcock. I think all Q's should be drected to JDM though, it's his hard work that may be the big payoff here - steve

Interesting!!!
JD, have you any cool info/data/insight to share?  What kind of solenoid is yours.

Steve, wasn't the one you tested the same as Bob's?  I reckon memory ain't what it used to/ought to be.


Yes JD and I have the same higher flow solenoid.  Mine is still in the bike.  I think I did a write up in the wiki.

http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php/topic,32983.0.html

  It, like anything else seems to need service ever few years or it to could form a leak.  Even though mine has not ever done that it did look "used" when I serviced mine after 2 years.  No spare parts though.  You have to buy a new one.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2013, 02:19:38 pm by smithr1 »
---
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Offline JDM

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #51 on: December 20, 2013, 03:27:08 pm »
Bob, Thanks for the comeback,   

Offline Zorlac

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #52 on: December 20, 2013, 04:23:02 pm »
"I have a brand new OEM petcock and I think a good examination every 3000-6000 miles is a good practice as well."

Dude, you're on to it!!
  ;)
I pull the hoses with a full tank and let it sit over night, no drips at all is a pass.
You can even put a little vacuum on the proper petcock port to fully verify its on/off operation.
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Offline Greg

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #53 on: December 20, 2013, 09:31:58 pm »
Greg, you seem to be the only one who has answered my question, got a picture??......my question was.........".I'm not sure physically how you would do it?  Related to this, since this bike is total gravity feed, a longer fuel line or even a curl in the line, shouldn't make any difference should it? Couldn't the line even go down and back up? Just wondering if that would open the door to putting a manual shut off in the line, or would it cause other problems? Would it increase the chance of vapor lock? " .................

VisionDon,

Here is a photo of the $7 manual shut off valve I installed. I ride every day, and regularly take the bike into the north Georgia mountains near me and push the bike pretty hard. I have never had a fuel restriction or vapor lock issue. I used the stock fuel line, just cutting it to insert the manual fuel shutoff valve. IMHO, a manual nylon gas-resistant valve is the cheapest, most effective insurance against hydrolock.

If I had lots of disposable income, I'd definitely opt for the overflow tubes AND the manual shutoff valve. Placing a label reading "Gas?" on my gauges reminds me to turn it on and off. Believe me, you will know pretty quick if you forget to turn it ON. 

By the way, I bought my carb rebuild kit via Murph's. I was very pleased with the kit and his fast shipping.
Greg Janney
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Offline JDM

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #54 on: December 20, 2013, 10:17:46 pm »
Greg, looks like you took the bull by the horns and did something to help prevent hydrolock on your Connie that works for you and is a frugal fix. Hats off to you. JD   :great:

Offline Strawboss

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #55 on: December 20, 2013, 11:34:23 pm »
You can use this too, a little more than $7, but not much. Same part number as my '82 KZ and my 2001 Concours.

http://eaglemike.com/Manual-Petcock-for-KLR650-mpcy.htm
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Offline EBAD

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #56 on: December 21, 2013, 06:54:25 pm »
Not hooked up as the bike is winterized, but Here is my cheapo valve


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Offline Altitude

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #57 on: December 22, 2013, 11:50:39 am »
I asked the same thing and someone replied saying the Concours had a fragile and sensitive fuel delivery system.
We love our bikes and all but $500 to fix a problem that might happen on a $2000 bike? Really?


  Btw good job on the shut off Greg..

Offline JDM

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #58 on: December 22, 2013, 12:56:45 pm »
I asked the same thing and someone replied saying the Concours had a fragile and sensitive fuel delivery system.
We love our bikes and all but $500 to fix a problem that might happen on a $2000 bike? Really?


  Btw good job on the shut off Greg..

How much is it worth to you to prevent hydrolock? 

Offline Bill Hookman

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #59 on: December 22, 2013, 01:59:47 pm »
Greg,
Great idea on that shut off valve.  But, isn't that valve for 1/4" fuel line?  I believe our fuel line is 5/16".  I would be worried about the restriction it's adding, even though, you have never had any issues with fuel starvation.  But, you also say most of your riding is in the mountains and I think the majority of fuel starvation issues are experienced at constant highway speeds.  With that said, there are 5/16" shut off valves similar to that one on Amazon and Ebay, but they cost a little more and are brass.
Bill Hookman  Columbus, OH

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Offline Ron_Moss_MO

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #60 on: December 22, 2013, 03:03:39 pm »
When I work on my bikes or cars it is in a non heated garage with no ignition source. 17 years as a professional firefighter years ago
wised me up real quick. The number of gasoline fires I fought are unbelievable. Rev, I'm with you on this one.
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Offline VTconnie

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #61 on: December 22, 2013, 05:08:38 pm »
When I work on my bikes or cars it is in a non heated garage with no ignition source. 17 years as a professional firefighter years ago
wised me up real quick. The number of gasoline fires I fought are unbelievable. Rev, I'm with you on this one.

Thats scary,

What about people who weld things on-the-car? that can't be safe
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Offline WillyP

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #62 on: December 22, 2013, 06:31:10 pm »
It's not, and yet people do it everyday. Go work in an auto-body shop for a week and you'll wonder how they ever survived.
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Offline Rev Ryder

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #63 on: December 23, 2013, 12:06:11 am »
It's not, and yet people do it everyday. Go work in an auto-body shop for a week and you'll wonder how they ever survived.
I owned several body shops for 23 years.  I am a second career minister. I sold my shops in 2001 and have not worked in the industry seriously since 2003. But back then, tThe fire marshal who comes to inspect your place, if he/she are worth their salt, will generally help you figure it out how to stay alive and will happily shut you down until you really understand the risk.  DAMHIK 

Even then it's dangerous.  Even though my last building was over 9000 sq. ft. and welding could be well isolated from the paint area, and booths and "stations" were required for dust control or hazardous situations, as well as paint application and prep... and all flammable liquids, paint gun cleaning machines, and wastes were required to be kept in an airtight room with a TWO hour burn time and cement filled metal doors... and mine was NOT a huge operation by any measure. 

All of that and considerable luck kept us from being blown to bits and burning down though we did suffer a few fires and injuries over the years BEFORE all of the above became the norm.  Fortunately we never lost a day's work time or a building from any of those incidents.  But WillyP is spot on speaking to that being about as potentially hazardous a fire place as there is.  I still find it amazing we didn't have more or larger fires than we did.
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Offline Greg

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #64 on: December 26, 2013, 05:30:23 pm »
Greg,
Great idea on that shut off valve.  But, isn't that valve for 1/4" fuel line?  I believe our fuel line is 5/16".  I would be worried about the restriction it's adding, even though, you have never had any issues with fuel starvation.  But, you also say most of your riding is in the mountains and I think the majority of fuel starvation issues are experienced at constant highway speeds.  With that said, there are 5/16" shut off valves similar to that one on Amazon and Ebay, but they cost a little more and are brass.

Bill, I appreciate the info and think a brass 5/16" valve would be a better solution because of it matching the fuel line size and the better durability of brass. Btw, I also commute 70 miles per day on interstate at 70 to 85 mph (shh! don't tell the State Patrol!), and have never experienced any fuel restriction issues during my commutes. I haven't done any research on where to find the brass shut off valve you mentioned. You got any suggestions?
Greg Janney
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Offline Bill Hookman

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #65 on: December 26, 2013, 08:41:06 pm »
I bought one here:

http://www.amazon.com/Parts-Unlimited-Fuel-Shut-Off-Valve/dp/B00230ECOK/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1388093969&sr=8-2&keywords=5%2F16+shut+off+valve

I haven't received it yet and won't be able to try it out until spring, so I can't tell you how or if it works.
Bill Hookman  Columbus, OH

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Offline EJ

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #66 on: February 04, 2015, 05:28:14 pm »
I AM NEW TO COG  JUST GOT A 1994 CONCOURS IT RUNS GREAT BUT SEEMED IT SHOULD HAVE MOORE POWER THEN I CHECKED THE PIPES NUMBER 4 IS NOT HOT REPLACED PETCOCK  IT HAD A LEAK WHAT POSITION SHOULD PETCOCK BE IN WHEN NOT RIDING, AND IS THIS HYDROLOCK.

Offline Jim

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #67 on: February 04, 2015, 05:53:21 pm »
The stock petcock should be left in the ON (tab down) or RES (tab pointing toward seat) position.  The third position is PRIME (tab pointing forward).  Never leave the petcock in this position for any length of time.  It is used to bypass the vacuum actuated shutoff valve in the petcock.  You would use PRIME if you ran the bike out of gas or the bike had been sitting for a week or more.  If you use PRIME, it only takes about 30 to 45 seconds to fill the carb bowls.  Once the bike is started, move the lever back to ON or RES.
A cold exhaust pipe usually means the cylinder is not firing, not hydrolock.  You might want to start a new topic for this problem.

Offline Pbfoot

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #68 on: February 04, 2015, 07:21:42 pm »
I lurked on the forum for a few weeks before purchasing my 06. My first purchase was a new oem peacock. I wish I had bought a manual petcock. Turning off the fuel is hardwired in my brain as well. Just out of curiosity I have tried to find anecdotal evidence of hydrolock in other models and am unable to find much. I think the volume of fuel in the Connie (and the lack of overflow tubes) makes these bikes susceptible to hydrolock much more than other models. In the summer I normally only run with half a tank due to fumes in the garage. If I am not going to ride for a while I make sure the fuel level is low. With my twins in braces and iPhones my carbs will not be going anywhere for a while.
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Offline gottaride

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #69 on: February 04, 2015, 07:56:04 pm »
The peacock on my 94 leaked so I replaced it with a new OEM petcock. Three times thus far when removing the fuel line I have had a gusher of gas all over my hands and yes I did disconnect the vacuum line to the petcock first. Now whenever I disconnect the fuel line from the petcock I first remove the vacuum PLUS I take a short section  of 5/16 I.D. vinyl hose and attach it to the vacuum nipple then apply a slight amount of positive pressure to move that friggin' diaphragm. Then and only then does the fuel line come off.

This will be the forth year that I've run a 5/16 I.D. manual fuel shut off valve immediately downstream of the stock petcock. I installed overflow tubes last winter and thus don't use the manual shut off on day rides. It does however get used when done riding for the day and of course during longer periods when not riding. My C10 is in the garage below my bedroom and I sleep just fine.

My #4 carbs drips via the overflow tube and will be serviced soon. The leak is probably from not sealing the tube into it's hole properly and not from the float seal because they are quite new and not likely contaminated. My bad for leaving it. If I hadn't installed the second fuel shutoff it would leak all the time.

Question. What is the typical amount of fuel that the overflow tubes tend to drip with a hot C10 parked on it's kickstand say on a 100F day in sunshine?
« Last Edit: February 08, 2015, 03:37:09 pm by gottaride »

Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #70 on: February 04, 2015, 08:02:00 pm »
after riding, the vapor condenses and you'll get a couple drops from the overflow hose if you haven't done a low to  high "p trap" in the line, that seems to stop it. steve
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Offline Jim

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #71 on: February 04, 2015, 08:46:45 pm »
Have you tried Dan Bergmen's petcock conversion? 
http://www.bergmenengineering.com/ManualPetcockConversion.shtml

If I remember correctly, it gives you a real OFF, ON and RES position and bypasses the vacuum actuated path thru the petcock (one less vacuum hose to the carbs). 

Offline WillyP

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #72 on: February 04, 2015, 11:07:49 pm »
I AM NEW TO COG  JUST GOT A 1994 CONCOURS IT RUNS GREAT BUT SEEMED IT SHOULD HAVE MOORE POWER THEN I CHECKED THE PIPES NUMBER 4 IS NOT HOT REPLACED PETCOCK  IT HAD A LEAK WHAT POSITION SHOULD PETCOCK BE IN WHEN NOT RIDING, AND IS THIS HYDROLOCK.

If one pipe is not hot it is likely not running on that cylinder, or that cylinder is running rich. However, neither are the result of a leaking petcock.

My advice is if you want help start a new thread. And please TURN OFF THE CAPS-LOCK!
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Offline rickm_tx

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #73 on: February 05, 2015, 04:35:53 pm »
And please TURN OFF THE CAPS-LOCK!

amen
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Offline Bill_Heil_NM

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Re: How come we don't all install in-line fuel valves to block hydolock?
« Reply #74 on: February 05, 2015, 04:51:10 pm »
I had a manual petcock conversion on my bike and you just have to train yourself to turn the thing off everytime you stop the bike.  I cam from riding a BMW airhead and that was the drill.  stop the bike, turn the petcocks off.  simple.  I don't have overflow tubes, had the bike for ten  years and never had a problem.   And when you disconnect the hose to take the tank off, you don't have to worry about gas dripping out.  YOU CAN get in the habit of turning the petcock off.
Try riding a BMW with plastic QDs in the fuel line that will crack and spew gas all over you and the bike while riding down the road.  Ughhhhhhhhhhhhh.