Author Topic: Need some help in planning on the order of events  (Read 974 times)

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Offline dboogie2288

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Need some help in planning on the order of events
« on: July 20, 2017, 01:39:50 pm »
Ok, so I bought this 02 a few weeks ago and it's getting the gold treatment. JBox should be back this week, and carbs hopefully, next week. I'm figuring, while the bike is broke down, I'll do a valve adjustment. Makes sense right?

Well the main issue with the bike when I bought it was it had a 'miss.' Not saying an actual spark miss or anything like that, it was just, off. To me, in my unprofessional opinion it felt like there was too much air getting in. Well, lo and behold, the airbox is cracked in like 3 places, and there are at least 2 springs missing from the boots. So, I feel like my unqualified diagnosis was accurate. My brain says, "do the valve adjustment now , before the carbs come back,".... but the other side of my brain says, "if it doesnt run, you have WAYY too many thing to chase down at this moment, do the valve adjustment later."

So anyhow, help me order these events:
-Reinstall carbs
-Sync carbs
-Valve adjustment

I already have some 'gotchas' going on here since I changed the plug wires and plugs. Those are simple things, and shouldn't be a problem.
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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2017, 02:03:16 pm »
While the carbs are at the spa I would fix the airbox cracks(See SISF video)
When the carbs return they should be pretty spot on as far as doing a synch (Mine were)
I would do a valve adjust while everything is off and accessible but thats just me
Murph should have the springs IIRC

I have no idea about anything.
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Offline dboogie2288

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2017, 02:27:57 pm »
Yeah I actually have a new-to-me airbox coming in from ebay. I think it would take an entire tube of epoxy to fix this beater.

I wondered if steve syncs them, however I would assume that the valve condition would affect the sync, yes?
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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2017, 03:52:51 pm »
When mine came back from the spa I hooked up the synch guages and I didnt turn all of them put together a 1/4 turn I did do the valves while they were gone
I have no idea about anything.
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Offline Mettler1

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2017, 04:07:37 pm »
  Murphs' has the carb boot springs. And ships FAST!!  https://www.murphskits.com/product_info.php?cPath=1_107&products_id=219

   Got my Carbs back from "the Spa" (SisF) a couple pf yrs ago and as far as sync almost perfect. Best thing was when you crank the throttle at idle it's instant revs!! SWEET!! :) :)
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Offline VTconnie

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2017, 06:39:19 pm »
Definitely get those valves in spec first, there will be no use in installing perfect carbs and trying to sync otherwise, you will just have to do it again. And with new plugs and wires, and a fortified air box, I imagine there will no chance of a "miss".
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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2017, 07:37:43 pm »
Steve does a bench synch on every set, and I can bet its gonna be spot on. I do the same thing on a carb refurb, and seldom if ever, can I turn an adjusting screw 1/8 turn if at all, when doing a final synch..

But

Steve will re enforce this creedo...
Doing a carb synch, without the valves correctly adjusted, and verified, is a waste of time...
Valves must be correct, for the synch to be viable, so dive in there and do the valves...

Also, while you are at it, tug on the ends of each plug wire, and make sure they are all intact, or better yet, grab the wire, and hold it with a rag, and "unscrew" the plug end, and examine the core of the wire... now is the time to do this, if there is any green crusty corrosion visible on the end of the wire, trim it back about 1/2-3/4" and cut it flush, spritz inside the cap, and insert the wire, again holding tightly with a rag, and while pressing the wire firmly in, "re-screw" the cap back onto the wire end... the pin inside is threaded, and will screw into the core of the wire strands about 1/2".

Now you can take that possible "miss" culpret out of the equation, in about 15 minutes of your time, and its free...

Airbox and carbs can be done when you get it all back... do as much prior, to get it out of the way, while stuff is stripped off the bike...

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW

Offline ron203

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2017, 07:42:06 pm »
Use a new valve cover gasket and new plug well gaskets as well. No leaks.
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Offline VTconnie

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2017, 07:48:23 pm »
Use a new valve cover gasket and new plug well gaskets as well. No leaks.

+1 to that as well, along with all the other good advice. Connie is a simple girl, she has her needs and you can get most of them done at once.
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Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2017, 02:02:31 am »
Adjust valves; insure that each plug wire / boot has 5k resistance, if open or greater just replace the boots and wires (cheap); repair airbox if necessary. Do the free power mod.  THEN reinstall the carbs. Steve
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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2017, 04:14:08 am »
Adjust valves; insure that each plug wire / boot has 5k resistance, if open or greater just replace the boots and wires (cheap); repair airbox if necessary. Do the free power mod.  THEN reinstall the carbs. Steve

Ok...
I'm cheap...
Why replace perfectly good boots, and complete wires... when only about 1/2" of the end of the wire is compromised by corrosion, even cutting a full inch off if necessary still works....
Just asking. Having done this a bazillion tjmes on various connis.
Now if the boot has the "threaded needle" erroded, after a long time of internal arcing, yeah, replace it... but I've only seen one bike where it occurred in the last 15 years.
I will admit, it was on my COGZilla bike...which was a piece of doo doo when I purchased it... but...
I had a spare set of old caps and wires, and made a new set of wires for it using 7mm ACCELL wires from autozone, silicone wires, with tinned stranded copper core...  I made 4 complete wire sets from that $20 wire kit.
Most folks can trim and reassemble their existing stuff, for free.

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Offline dboogie2288

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2017, 12:00:39 pm »
Definitely get those valves in spec first, there will be no use in installing perfect carbs and trying to sync otherwise, you will just have to do it again. And with new plugs and wires, and a fortified air box, I imagine there will no chance of a "miss".

Sweet that's what I was thinking too....
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Offline alan

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2017, 04:27:23 pm »
I might add re: spark plug caps...  Look down into the where the cap attaches to the spark plug; see a brass screw down there? Unscrew it and out will drop a resistor and little spring. Clean and shine that up and screw it back in. Even if the wires are replaced corrosion inside the cap will cause problems. Just my .03 cents adjusted for the US/Cdn exchange rate. Happy Motoring.
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Offline dboogie2288

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2017, 05:51:20 pm »
Ah nah, I got new caps all together. Brand new between the coil and the combustion chamber.
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Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2017, 07:09:59 pm »
Adjust valves; insure that each plug wire / boot has 5k resistance, if open or greater just replace the boots and wires (cheap); repair airbox if necessary. Do the free power mod.  THEN reinstall the carbs. Steve

Ok...
I'm cheap...
Why replace perfectly good boots, and complete wires... when only about 1/2" of the end of the wire is compromised by corrosion, even cutting a full inch off if necessary still works....
Just asking. Having done this a bazillion tjmes on various connis.
Now if the boot has the "threaded needle" erroded, after a long time of internal arcing, yeah, replace it... but I've only seen one bike where it occurred in the last 15 years.
I will admit, it was on my COGZilla bike...which was a piece of doo doo when I purchased it... but...
I had a spare set of old caps and wires, and made a new set of wires for it using 7mm ACCELL wires from autozone, silicone wires, with tinned stranded copper core...  I made 4 complete wire sets from that $20 wire kit.
Most folks can trim and reassemble their existing stuff, for free.

Simple, because in my experience, here in the south, the problem isn't the corrosion in the wires, it's actually serious corrosion internally in the caps. And since most folks don't have ohmeters handy, replacing the part (and inexpensive parts at that) is the best way to be sure the ignition isn't an issue.

 Steve
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Offline Mettler1

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2017, 09:50:57 pm »
'94 Concours 115,000 miles-- 7th gear,2MM,KB fork brace,Over flowtubes,Stick coils,Tcro shifter,GPS,SiSF'sTorque cams,SPOOKFAK,block off plates, SS brake & clutch lines,KB risers, FENDA EXTENDA, emulators, SiSF carb Spa, Delkevic exhaust, Murphs' knee savers +grips, etc

Offline connie_rider

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2017, 01:27:49 am »
Adjust valves; insure that each plug wire / boot has 5k resistance, if open or greater just replace the boots and wires (cheap); repair airbox if necessary. Do the free power mod.  THEN reinstall the carbs. Steve

Ok...
I'm cheap...
Why replace perfectly good boots, and complete wires... when only about 1/2" of the end of the wire is compromised by corrosion, even cutting a full inch off if necessary still works....
Just asking. Having done this a bazillion tjmes on various connis.
Now if the boot has the "threaded needle" erroded, after a long time of internal arcing, yeah, replace it... but I've only seen one bike where it occurred in the last 15 years.
I will admit, it was on my COGZilla bike...which was a piece of doo doo when I purchased it... but...
I had a spare set of old caps and wires, and made a new set of wires for it using 7mm ACCELL wires from autozone, silicone wires, with tinned stranded copper core...  I made 4 complete wire sets from that $20 wire kit.
Most folks can trim and reassemble their existing stuff, for free.

Simple, because in my experience, here in the south, the problem isn't the corrosion in the wires, it's actually serious corrosion internally in the caps. And since most folks don't have ohmeters handy, replacing the part (and inexpensive parts at that) is the best way to be sure the ignition isn't an issue.

 Steve

 I can vouch for what he sez. I fought problems on my 2000 for months.
   Had Steve rebuild carbs, installed new petcock, filters, trimmed wire ends etc.
     Still had intermittent problems that I (and friends) could NOT figure out.

Later I took it to an event and had Steve look at it.
He looked at it and sed,,,, it's the caps...

We changed the wires and caps. 
     "Problem solved"
I got my wires/caps from Murph.
         (Murphs:  https://www.murphskits.com/product_info.php?cPath=1_92&products_id=51)

Ride safe, Ted
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 04:45:33 pm by connie_rider »
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Offline dboogie2288

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2017, 04:50:55 pm »
I get the NGK 8080 caps, and a few 26" spark plug leads from oreilly for a total of about 12 bucks. Seems dumb not to do it if you're doing that much work to it.
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Offline dboogie2288

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #18 on: July 24, 2017, 02:26:38 am »
Valve adjustment is done....but now I need orings for the rear coolant log. I loosened the bolts a bit to help with the removal of the valve cover, and of course now its leaking.

If this thing runs when I put it together, I'm quite literally going to piss myself.  :truce:

If it does though, it's oh-happy-day, and she will be good for a good long time. New fuel lines, new orings, carb serviced, valves done, I mean she really is ready to rock and roll.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 02:40:41 am by dboogie2288 »
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Offline VTconnie

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #19 on: July 24, 2017, 05:12:05 pm »
Valve adjustment is done....but now I need orings for the rear coolant log. I loosened the bolts a bit to help with the removal of the valve cover, and of course now its leaking.

If this thing runs when I put it together, I'm quite literally going to piss myself.  :truce:

If it does though, it's oh-happy-day, and she will be good for a good long time. New fuel lines, new orings, carb serviced, valves done, I mean she really is ready to rock and roll.

You know, I was going to suggest you do your rear coolant log o-rings while you were in there, but didn't want to pile on the tasks. The good news is the rear coolant log is easiest, and you won't have to fuss with this stuff once it's done.
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Offline GKreamer

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #20 on: July 24, 2017, 06:00:42 pm »
The O rings are pretty simple.  Did mine last year, front and rear.  MOB suggested scotch brite-ing (is that a word?) the tube ends till they're shiny then using fork oil on the O rings to ease installation.  Worked like a charm, and I painted the logs too, as well as cleaning the ports they fit into.  If you see what looks like hard water stains you should consider replacing.  Also the tstat O ring, yeesh!  That thing was melted into goo!

Offline dboogie2288

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #21 on: July 25, 2017, 01:21:05 pm »

You know, I was going to suggest you do your rear coolant log o-rings while you were in there, but didn't want to pile on the tasks. The good news is the rear coolant log is easiest, and you won't have to fuss with this stuff once it's done.

Nah man, speak up...had I not caused the leak by loosening the log, I woulda just moved right along.......it only makes sense to do the tstat and orings when its this broke down.
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Offline dboogie2288

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #22 on: July 31, 2017, 03:41:03 pm »
Man I love the ZG1000!!  It works!   :-\

It's a true testament  to how this thing is built when a mope like me can get into it, do some needed maintenance, and then it works the first push of the starter. Ok, well second, but I just stopped to turn the choke on which I had forgotten. This wasn't a matter of doing one specific job...it was doing ALL the jobs on the top/front of this bike. I keep a spreadsheet of everything I do on each of my vehicles, and this 2002 has 20 entries, and I've not even really ridden it yet....  :o

Hydrolock test - All good
Spark plug wires
Spark plugs
Air Filter
Block off plates
Fuel line
New brake fluid
New clutch fluid
Saddlebag reflective decals
New light bulbs
New LED headlight
Valve adjustment
New airbox w/ repair mod
New thermostat
New rear coolant log orings
New valve cover gasket
New coolant
Final Drive oil
New brake pads EBC HH Sintered
Steve's Carb job & Overflow tubes

All this crap has been done over the last 3 weeks, and boom starts without hesitation. It has a bit of a flat acceleration between 4-5k rpm, but that was my fault. I bought 1/4" fuel line, and have the on/off valve that steve told me to ditch. So, once the 5/16" comes in, should be good. And, no leaks. My main concern was with the new coolant and valve job. I prepped and used a conservative amount of gasket maker, but it took me 3 tries on my 06 to get that damn gasket cover right. I think the difference here was the rear coolant log was off. That made all the difference in the world.

Man, what a bike.
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Offline Bud

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #23 on: July 31, 2017, 04:39:34 pm »
Man I love the ZG1000!!  It works!   :-\

It's a true testament  to how this thing is built when a mope like me can get into it, do some needed maintenance, and then it works the first push of the starter. Ok, well second, but I just stopped to turn the choke on which I had forgotten. This wasn't a matter of doing one specific job...it was doing ALL the jobs on the top/front of this bike. I keep a spreadsheet of everything I do on each of my vehicles, and this 2002 has 20 entries, and I've not even really ridden it yet....  :o

Hydrolock test - All good
Spark plug wires
Spark plugs
Air Filter
Block off plates
Fuel line
New brake fluid
New clutch fluid
Saddlebag reflective decals
New light bulbs
New LED headlight
Valve adjustment
New airbox w/ repair mod
New thermostat
New rear coolant log orings
New valve cover gasket
New coolant
Final Drive oil
New brake pads EBC HH Sintered
Steve's Carb job & Overflow tubes

All this crap has been done over the last 3 weeks, and boom starts without hesitation. It has a bit of a flat acceleration between 4-5k rpm, but that was my fault. I bought 1/4" fuel line, and have the on/off valve that steve told me to ditch. So, once the 5/16" comes in, should be good. And, no leaks. My main concern was with the new coolant and valve job. I prepped and used a conservative amount of gasket maker, but it took me 3 tries on my 06 to get that damn gasket cover right. I think the difference here was the rear coolant log was off. That made all the difference in the world.

Man, what a bike.
How much have you had to spend?

Offline dboogie2288

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Re: Need some help in planning on the order of events
« Reply #24 on: July 31, 2017, 05:27:02 pm »
I would say about $2200. A lot of stuff I already had. Fluids, oils, bulbs, etc.

Biggest spends were:
1200 - bike
450 - steve
80 - larry
300 - tires & mounting
300 - murphs
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