Author Topic: Should I replace the front coolant log o-rings while I'm swapping my engine?  (Read 505 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline drumstyx

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 311
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 12290
  • Membership Level: Active
Nothing indicates that the new motor had any coolant leaks, and the logs are both still in place, so I wonder if I should even bother doing the front o-rings proactively -- if it ain't broke, right? I've heard even the best of us have ended up having to redo them because of finnicky seating, and that's no small task when it requires removing the radiator and exhaust each time!

Offline Mettler1

  • Iron Butt
  • *****
  • Posts: 3028
  • You want answers? We got answers!!
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 1431
  • Membership Level: Active

   NAY, don't bother. You will have time to do it later. If it leaks later just say what I say, OH POOP!!  >:(
'94 Concours 115,000 miles-- 7th gear,2MM,KB fork brace,Over flowtubes,Stick coils,Tcro shifter,GPS,SiSF'sTorque cams,SPOOKFAK,block off plates, SS brake & clutch lines,KB risers, FENDA EXTENDA, emulators, SiSF carb Spa, Delkevic exhaust, Murphs' knee savers +grips, etc

Offline drumstyx

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 311
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 12290
  • Membership Level: Active
Perhaps a better question would be: Can I test for installation errors without installing everything up to and including the radiator? Is it a reasonable enough test to have no leaks *without* the engine running? (To avoid installing/removing/installing the exhaust)

I have loads of time (though only so much patience, I suppose), so that's not an issue at all, I just don't want to be repeating things.

Offline who me?

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 558
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: 11932
  • Membership Level: Active
Perhaps a better question would be: Can I test for installation errors without installing everything up to and including the radiator? Is it a reasonable enough test to have no leaks *without* the engine running? (To avoid installing/removing/installing the exhaust)

I have loads of time (though only so much patience, I suppose), so that's not an issue at all, I just don't want to be repeating things.
If you have access to a radiator pressure tester that will adapt to the filler neck
I have no idea about anything.
95 C10 The Mule
02 C10 parts are parts

Offline drumstyx

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 311
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 12290
  • Membership Level: Active
Oh that's an awesome idea, I can most likely borrow one.

Offline who me?

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 558
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: 11932
  • Membership Level: Active
You will have to seal the system to test Short of putting the radiator on you would need to run a hose to bypass the radiator or plug the lines
I have no idea about anything.
95 C10 The Mule
02 C10 parts are parts

Offline drumstyx

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 311
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 12290
  • Membership Level: Active
You will have to seal the system to test Short of putting the radiator on you would need to run a hose to bypass the radiator or plug the lines

Simply throwing on the radiator is no problem -- I'll hang it up with some wire or something, and it's just 2 hose clamps to attach it. I just didn't want to have to RUN the bike, which would mean installing the exhaust, oil cooler and bracket, AND radiator, only to find out I have to pull it all off (draining both oil and coolant again) to get at the log.

EDIT: Screw it, decision made -- I'm doing the hoses anyway, I just hate the fact that I'm so far in that if I screw up....it's a bad day...
« Last Edit: October 27, 2017, 12:20:59 am by drumstyx »

Online Steve in Sunny Fla

  • Industry Member
  • I Need a Life
  • *
  • Posts: 7318
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: 6977
  • Membership Level: Active
don't ever pass up the opportunity to do some preventative maintenance when everything is accessible. EVER. Steve
C-14 ECU flashing for performance and rideability enhancement
C-10 Carb work , cams, & performance enhancements
 " Modifications for sport-tourers, BY a sport-tourer"
https://sites.google.com/site/shoodabenengineering/home

Offline drumstyx

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 311
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 12290
  • Membership Level: Active
don't ever pass up the opportunity to do some preventative maintenance when everything is accessible. EVER. Steve

You're so right Steve, I was just being lazy!! :D

Plus, looking at how not-corroded things look after pulling the log, I don't think I'll have much of an issue, especially considering I'm doing this all with the entire engine OUT of the bike. Could only be easier if I had an engine stand....hmmmm

Online cra-z1000

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1889
  • Keeping it upright..
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 9790
  • Membership Level: Active
Why on earth wouldn't you ?
1987 C 10
80 Kawasaki KZ 1000 MK 2
74 Honda 750 four ss
73 Suzuki 550 triple
72 Honda 550 four

Offline drumstyx

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 311
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 12290
  • Membership Level: Active
Why on earth wouldn't you ?

Paranoia and laziness :)

I didn't know how things looked/worked in there, so I didn't want to screw it up, after the horror stories I've heard (even SiSF himself ending up with a leak on the front log at one point, if I read correctly). After seeing how the o-rings are seated, I'm confident I can do it right the first time. I have plenty of time, and patience enough to clean up any corrosion.

Online cra-z1000

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1889
  • Keeping it upright..
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 9790
  • Membership Level: Active
Yes , its tricky but will be much easier with everything off anyway .
1987 C 10
80 Kawasaki KZ 1000 MK 2
74 Honda 750 four ss
73 Suzuki 550 triple
72 Honda 550 four

Online MAN OF BLUES

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 6939
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 5977
  • Membership Level: Active
don't ever pass up the opportunity to do some preventative maintenance when everything is accessible. EVER. Steve

I second that emotion... :great:

No big dealeo, do it, use a dremel and small wire wheel to de funk the ports, and log ends, lube the rings and ports with fork oil, and shove it all back together while you can easily see its assembly.. no brainer.. and you won't have to ever do it again..
As for testing, non radiator atachment is neccesary, just plug all the coolant lines on the bench and fill the system with water..you will see a leaker if its gonna leak.. and if so desired, you can pressurize the system so what thru the top inlet with a rag and an airhose..it only has to hold 13 psi.. it will leak at 5 psi if its gonna leak..  do it while its out of the bike.. and be done with it...
 :great: :great:

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW

Offline drumstyx

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 311
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 12290
  • Membership Level: Active
Looks like I might have gotten lucky, or maybe this engine didn't have all that many miles on it, because all that was in the ports was minor grime that I could wipe out with a rag. Nice and shiny with a smooth beveled edge to make installation easy. All the tubes were corrosion-free where the o-rings went, with just minor corrosion where rubber hose meets steel tube.

Now I just have to remember which of some similar-looking hoses goes where...

Offline Daytona_Mike

  • Sport Tourer
  • *****
  • Posts: 2122
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
The thermostat gasket is another suspect gasket that turns to mush over time. I would change that one  while you got it out.
Normally aspirated engines have perpetual turbo lag
2000 Red C10 1052 kit
2008  C14 Silver Dammit Full AreaP- Flies are put back in SISF_Flash
2011  KLR650   688 piston ported and polished
2011  KTM 530    This thing is FUN!!

Offline JimBob

  • Sport Tourer
  • *****
  • Posts: 2692
  • Woman...WHOAAAA MAN!
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
don't ever pass up the opportunity to do some preventative maintenance when everything is accessible. EVER. Steve


This.


Holy crap this, especially since it's behind the headers, and new o-rings are freakin' cheap.


I grew up in a shop - customers never wanted to pay for fixing everything up front. Always ended up re-doing jobs months later when the declined repair fully failed.


Nowadays - if it's apart, it's getting rubber/wear items replaced.

Offline drumstyx

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 311
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 12290
  • Membership Level: Active
The thermostat gasket is another suspect gasket that turns to mush over time. I would change that one  while you got it out.

You're talking about the one joining the thermostat to the rear log, right? I replaced that one as well, but didn't disassemble the thermostat housing.

Online MAN OF BLUES

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 6939
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 5977
  • Membership Level: Active
The thermostat gasket is another suspect gasket that turns to mush over time. I would change that one  while you got it out.

You're talking about the one joining the thermostat to the rear log, right? I replaced that one as well, but didn't disassemble the thermostat housing.

No, the seal between the halves of the housing itself.. most people never go there, and thus the invisible issue.
They only last about 8 years, by my seasoned reasoning and accord of replacement interval.

Very wise to teplapce when access is available.

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW

Offline SteveJ.

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 5222
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: 5603
  • Membership Level: Asst. Area Director
While in the thermostat, put in a new one. I used a Stant Superstat, smoother operation.  I went with the 195 and liked the way it worked. Same part number as an 83 Honda Accord for a 195. Just clip off that little metal thingy you'll see on it.

Have fun.
Yeah, if you want true ram air tuning, you better be willing to ram some air! (SiSF)
Steve J  Tavares, FL, one of the Floriduh Steves
'15 Versys650LT, '98 KLR650, (back home), '99 C-10, 234k miles sold
IBA 19221

Offline JimBob

  • Sport Tourer
  • *****
  • Posts: 2692
  • Woman...WHOAAAA MAN!
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Keep in mind, if one piece of rubber has aged and failed, what's the likelihood of the rest of the rubber failing (since it's all the same age)?

Offline drumstyx

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 311
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 12290
  • Membership Level: Active
Keep in mind, if one piece of rubber has aged and failed, what's the likelihood of the rest of the rubber failing (since it's all the same age)?

None of it has, I just happened to have all the parts to replace them while I was swapping my engine for other reasons (bent rod).

I screwed up on installing the rear log, and ended up with a massive leak while I was filling it. Turns out I didn't pay attention while installing it and the o rings weren't even in place at all -- the carb boots actually got in the way and rolled back the o-rings. Turns out installing it (after inspecting the o-rings for damage) while in the frame is much harder than out of the frame, but I got that done without much trouble.

I also replaced all radiator hoses *except* the two that attach to the water pump and radiator with a hard pipe in the middle. I have new parts, but for some reason they weren't fitting quite right, even though similarly formed, and were nearly touching the exhaust. There was nothing wrong with my current hoses, and those are easy to replace, so I decided to use the old ones. From what I hear, the one in front behind the headers is the one that most often causes trouble, and is also most difficult to replace.

All that to say, I got the sucker running today :)

All that's left now is to swap in my new SiSF'd carbs, since I used my old carbs just in case there was engine trouble.

Online Grant

  • HOTROD TRUCKS & BIKES
  • Mini Bike
  • **
  • Posts: 154
  • AREA: Northwest Area
  • COG#: 12666
  • Membership Level: Active
That'll be a little like putting an engine and transmission in a car with an old clutch pressure plate and throwout bearing why????
2005 C10, 2016 C14 and a work in progress custom V-TWIN pro Street.