Author Topic: slow return to idle  (Read 1041 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Bud

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1707
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12907
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #50 on: June 13, 2019, 05:42:19 pm »
 :popcorncouple:
2005 Kawasaki Concours
1982 Suzuki GS1100GK
1983 Honda GL650I SilverWing

Offline batboy

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12983
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #51 on: June 13, 2019, 08:38:01 pm »
Carbs are back on the bike. The throttle cables threw a big fit and battled me for a while. Then, muscling the carbs onto the rubber couplers was a struggle too (I still don't have a heat gun). I need to tighten the clamps down, adjust the throttle cables, and reattach the choke cable. I should be able to finish up this evening. But first, it's time to rest my back and put my feet up for a few minutes. Maybe drink a cold one.

 :beerchug:
« Last Edit: June 13, 2019, 08:50:32 pm by batboy »
1988 Kawasaki Concours ZG1000 - Ninja Edition
Bike has the usual accessories and modifications

Offline connie_rider

  • "OtP" {retired/assistant} Slave Labor
  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 9525
  • Help us make "OtP" possible! "AGAIN"
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 4154
  • Membership Level: Asst. Area Director
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #52 on: June 13, 2019, 10:00:43 pm »
(Your wife's) Hair dryer work's well as a heat gun for this job.
  {Don't tell my wife I sed that}... :67:

Ride safe, Ted

14 Connie (Traveler II) / 03 Connie (Buddy)
Gone but not forgotten; 87 and 00 Connies..

If your not already a COGger, "consider becoming one".
Help us make "OtP" possible again!!

Offline DC Concours

  • Sport Tourer
  • *****
  • Posts: 2274
  • 2001 Concours, ~19K miles
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #53 on: June 13, 2019, 10:06:06 pm »
Great idea. Didn't think of this when I was doing mine.

(Your wife's) Hair dryer work's well as a heat gun for this job.
  {Don't tell my wife I sed that}... :67:

Ride safe, Ted



Offline batboy

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12983
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #54 on: June 14, 2019, 12:19:00 am »
I discovered that the two inner air box couplers were not completely on the carbs. So, I had another fight on my hands, and then, I also had trouble rolling those spring retainers into place.

I was messing with the throttle cable adjustment when the skeeters swarmed in. I put on that Deep Woods Off and those little blood suckers just held their noses and charged right in. No more work tonight.

I'll finish it up tomorrow morning. Hopefully it'll start.
1988 Kawasaki Concours ZG1000 - Ninja Edition
Bike has the usual accessories and modifications

Offline batboy

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12983
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #55 on: June 14, 2019, 04:25:24 pm »
This bike is a time machine. I went out to spend a minute adjusting the throttle cables and suddenly it's an hour into the future. The round rubber stops on the frame that the front of the tank slides onto would not stay on, even with duct tape. I ended up zip tying them. I notice it's another hour into the future. I tweak the fuel filter so it sits under the tank a bit better. Poof, I'm teleported another hour into the future again.

UPDATE: I started the motor briefly, but shut it off immediately. It sounded unusually loud. Maybe I didn't get one of the air box boots all the way on. I struggled with those center ones. The more I think about it, the noise did sort of sound like when you start a car with the air cleaner off. You got that loud sucking noise, especially with the choke on. Dunno, I'm going to take the tank back off and look closely. It did start though, so that was encouraging.
1988 Kawasaki Concours ZG1000 - Ninja Edition
Bike has the usual accessories and modifications

Offline crag antler

  • Mini Bike
  • **
  • Posts: 170
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: 8277
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #56 on: June 14, 2019, 05:01:56 pm »
It may be too late for you but 2 tips.
New air box boots will do wonders for you.
Tire spoon works great for putting boots onto carbs with no worry of punctures.
Doug aka crag antler
00 Kawasaki Concours 60,000+ miles. Bar risers, Murphs kneesavers, blockoff plates, allen head screw set,headlight upgrade. LED headlight, driving lights, JC Whitney trunk, Go Pro mount,’06 header w/Jet-Hot ceramic coating, over flow tubes and Performance Exhaust Sprocket by SISF

Offline batboy

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12983
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #57 on: June 14, 2019, 05:17:25 pm »
The couplers between the carbs and engine all look good. Clamps are all nice and tight. On #2 carb, the air boot is not all the way on in one spot, but it don't look like it would leak. I'll mess with that a little and triple check everything else again.

Dumb question. Would the engine sound noticeably louder without the middle fairing on? I started it once back in October with the middle fairing off, but I really don't remembering the bike sounding louder. But, I wasn't being paranoid about whether I got the carbs back together correctly, like today.
1988 Kawasaki Concours ZG1000 - Ninja Edition
Bike has the usual accessories and modifications

Offline m in sc

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 381
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #58 on: June 14, 2019, 05:27:22 pm »
you'll hear more noise for sure. just try it. see if it feels better and the hanging idle issue is resolved.

Offline batboy

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12983
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #59 on: June 14, 2019, 06:26:30 pm »
I got the air box boot slid a tad more onto Carb #2. If I do this again, I'll get new boots like Steve suggested in his video. On the other side, it had felt like all the intake couplers were tight when checked with a screwdriver, but when I looked at the screws on the clamps to make sure they were nearly bottomed out, two on #4 carb were not even close to being all the way tight. Rust on the clamp threads made me think the screws were tight. I loosened that clamp up and sprayed it with PB Blaster. I worked the aqdjustor screw in and out a few times. Now the clamp screws down all the way. Hope that was the problem.

I looked everything over real close one final time and saw gas hanging in drips on the bottom of #4 carb. "Oh guano!" I felt my chest clench up and my heart started pounding, I worried that I was going to have the "big one" (deadly heart attack). "I'm coming, Elizabeth!"  Wait a minute, that "gas" looks funny (odd not haha funny). It's yellowish and looks oily. I dip a finger in it and smell. It's PB Blaster (LOL). I had just used it on the nearby clamp and excess ended up there. Whew!

Guess I'll put the tank back on and see what happens.
1988 Kawasaki Concours ZG1000 - Ninja Edition
Bike has the usual accessories and modifications

Offline DC Concours

  • Sport Tourer
  • *****
  • Posts: 2274
  • 2001 Concours, ~19K miles
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #60 on: June 14, 2019, 07:01:15 pm »
Make a video, make a video. I can barely stand the suspense. Good job doing all this and giving us a blow by blow.

Offline Pbfoot

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1368
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 10807
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #61 on: June 14, 2019, 07:52:52 pm »
Make sure the PAIR valve  big rubber hose is inserted into the top of the airbox. Will make quite a racket if you forget.  Don't ask me how I know.
If you don't have time to do it right, when do you have time to do it over.                                                                17" wheels, Nissin 4 piston calipers.1kg Sonic Springs.Cartridge Fork Emulators. KB Brace. Galfer brake lines  Free power mod.

Offline batboy

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12983
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #62 on: June 14, 2019, 08:25:47 pm »
Should have a web cam since this is almost in real time.

PBfoot, you nailed it, dude. That tube must have pulled out of the box when I moved the box back to make more room for the carb removal. Doh, seems so obvious now. Unplugged hole in the air box and open tube coming from the valve cover. Thank you!

Unable to find anything else wrong, I started it up and warmed it up enough to move the choke completely off. It's idling much smoother, but it's idling at about 1500 rpm instead of 1000. I'm assuming the idle dropped too low to stay running, thus the previous owner probably turned up the idle to max to compensate. That would suggest the pilot jets were getting clogged even before I bought it and let it set for 6 months. I'm sure that didn't help.

I suspect the higher and smoother idle means I fixed the problem, but I need to ride it to make sure. The idle rarely hung when parked, it usually did it while cruising around, Guess I'll test ride it without the middle fairing.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2019, 10:41:24 pm by batboy »
1988 Kawasaki Concours ZG1000 - Ninja Edition
Bike has the usual accessories and modifications

Offline batboy

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12983
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #63 on: June 14, 2019, 09:18:49 pm »
Fixed! It's running perfect now. I learned a lot from this adventure. Thanks to all that helped.

 :great:

1988 Kawasaki Concours ZG1000 - Ninja Edition
Bike has the usual accessories and modifications

Offline Bud

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1707
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12907
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #64 on: June 14, 2019, 10:36:10 pm »
 :beerchug: :great: :motonoises: :motonoises:
2005 Kawasaki Concours
1982 Suzuki GS1100GK
1983 Honda GL650I SilverWing

Offline Pbfoot

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1368
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 10807
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #65 on: June 15, 2019, 10:47:15 am »
You're welcome. Glad I could help.
If you don't have time to do it right, when do you have time to do it over.                                                                17" wheels, Nissin 4 piston calipers.1kg Sonic Springs.Cartridge Fork Emulators. KB Brace. Galfer brake lines  Free power mod.

Offline batboy

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12983
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #66 on: June 15, 2019, 12:39:03 pm »
If your bike seems to have a rough idle (rpm "lopes" or fluctuates) and idle speed is low, then you might have clogged pilot jets (causes a lean condition). Many if not most Concours owners will adjust the idle speed knob to compensate for the drop in idle speed. That is a valuable clue if you just recently bought one like I did. If the idle adjustment knob had been adjusted to the max position, that's a red flag. It suggests there's a problem. The pilot jet is not only used for idle, but covers low speeds up to 3000-3500 rpm. Problems with the pilot jets mean poor low speed performance. Hard starting is another clue. Be careful, a vacuum leak might have the same symptoms. I recommend checking for vacuum leaks prior to carb removal. MOB has good info about looking for vacuum leaks.

Why do pilot jets clog up so easy? They are the smallest jets in the carb, so they are the first to get gummed up. Untreated gasoline (especially if it contains alcohol) will go stale after a few weeks and start causing problems. If your bike sat for a long time, there's a good chance you'll have some issues with gunk in the carbs from the bad gas. Where is the pilot jet? Under the bowl next to the main jet. I'd say carb removal is pretty much required. Technically, some people have removed the bowls from the carbs with them still on the bike, but you'd need small hands of a child and special tools. So, not impossible, but realistically, forget it. Carb removal is a bit intimidating, but if I can do it, anyone can.
1988 Kawasaki Concours ZG1000 - Ninja Edition
Bike has the usual accessories and modifications

Offline batboy

  • Scooter
  • ***
  • Posts: 294
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 12983
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #67 on: June 15, 2019, 07:14:13 pm »
I decided to do the fuel gauge variable resistor mod to finish up. This will be fun to calibrate now.

Got the fairing back on and took the bike for a 30 mile test ride. Runs great. I can't get over how smooth it idles now compared to before.

Here's a photo of my bike out in the middle of nowhere Kansas during my test ride. My bike always seems to brighten up the landscape.
1988 Kawasaki Concours ZG1000 - Ninja Edition
Bike has the usual accessories and modifications

Offline m in sc

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 381
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: slow return to idle
« Reply #68 on: June 15, 2019, 09:22:01 pm »



glad its sorted.  :great: