Author Topic: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?  (Read 834 times)

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Offline m in sc

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spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« on: August 27, 2017, 04:02:06 am »
noticed on aride on the blueridge my fan had some melted blades. i know, not a concern but i don't like it.  also, the fan cycles a bit too long for my liking, the 4 blade stocker isnt real efficient. yes the thermostat and radiator fan switch are good (put a new switch in out of preventative maint actually) .  i tried finding a muzzy fan online, don't seem to have any luck, was considering an SPAL fan. have one on my ktm and it cooled the motor down in about half the time the stocker did (the 1st gen us model 390 dukes were known to have issues with their fans coming apart.. long story)  anyway, has anybody done this.. and if not, what are the dimensions of the stock fan housing? dia and depth? this way i can find a good replacement from the aftermarket. thanks.  :beerchug:

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2017, 05:19:29 am »
noticed on aride on the blueridge my fan had some melted blades. i know, not a concern but i don't like it.  also, the fan cycles a bit too long for my liking, the 4 blade stocker isnt real efficient. yes the thermostat and radiator fan switch are good (put a new switch in out of preventative maint actually) .  i tried finding a muzzy fan online, don't seem to have any luck, was considering an SPAL fan. have one on my ktm and it cooled the motor down in about half the time the stocker did (the 1st gen us model 390 dukes were known to have issues with their fans coming apart.. long story)  anyway, has anybody done this.. and if not, what are the dimensions of the stock fan housing? dia and depth? this way i can find a good replacement from the aftermarket. thanks.  :beerchug:

If your fan melted, it wasn't working to start with.. so any bladenset wouldn't help.
Muzzy went out of business monthes ago, du to b/s products, never reserched, and designed for specific applications... they just did media overkill, and folded up.

Seriously, of the tens of thousands of Concours bikes on the road, melted fans are a small pimple.. if the motor doesn't work... it melts, it ain't the blades..

Go on ebay, buy some working fans, with blades, for 1/4 of the price anyone is trying to sell an aluminum blade replacement for... and use it..
If the fans are always running, you need to do some mechanical work, because they kick on and off, controlled by a thermo unit.. and if that ain't working, an aluminum fan ain't either..

Cause and effect bro...

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW

Offline m in sc

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2017, 12:26:10 pm »
its working, i just did a 3 day trip on it. i'm pretty sure the blade tips were melted prior to me getting the bike, then whatever caused the original issue was fixed, prior issue maybe? who knows.. history isn't known from new until about 3 years ago.  everything at this point is working as it should, i'm trying to make it more efficient is all.

as said, can anybody give me some dimensions to avoid me having to pull mine out to measure? thanks.

Offline m in sc

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2017, 01:17:32 pm »
disregard. i ordered a spare and will take dimensions off that myself for a modern fan. will be selling after im done with it, cheap, if anybody needs a replacement stocker as that seems to be the preference here. thanks for the recommendation anyway.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 05:03:11 pm by m in sc »

Offline m in sc

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2017, 05:23:48 pm »
as an fyi i received the spare stock fan to measure. ordered an spal 7.5" 10 blade fan with a 5 amp draw (max) moving 440 cfm, its on its way. cost was 51 bucks shipped. I hope this helps somebody down the road.

Offline dboogie2288

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2017, 06:15:27 pm »
as an fyi i received the spare stock fan to measure. ordered an spal 7.5" 10 blade fan with a 5 amp draw (max) moving 440 cfm, its on its way. cost was 51 bucks shipped. I hope this helps somebody down the road.

Linky? If you like this vendor, certainly happy to support them too.
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Offline m in sc

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2017, 06:59:03 pm »
got mine thru an industrial connection, but here:

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/bci-75060


im actually 99% sure it will plug directly in to the harness as well.

Offline turbo-max

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2017, 07:51:03 pm »
never hurts to be cool, if it works better, let us know, if it sucks, let us know!
turbo lag is a courteous head start!    ~Jeff H
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Offline Grant

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2017, 02:14:33 pm »
I just got a used e-Bay replacement fan myself. I was in traffic when the fan started sounding as if the bearing when out and the bike began to heat up. The fan I got off e-Bay has one blade with a small melted spot, I figured my motor had a bad bearing and I would just use my fan blade on the new motor. To my surprise when I pull the bike apart I found melted shredded and separated from the motor. When I checked my old fan motor it seems to function fine.
2005 C10, 2016 C14 and a work in progress custom V-TWIN pro Street.

Offline Grant

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2017, 04:02:35 pm »
Here is the used replacement and what I found when I removed the.old one.
https://goo.gl/photos/ch5xVsQAHxaPadZCA
2005 C10, 2016 C14 and a work in progress custom V-TWIN pro Street.

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2017, 06:49:44 pm »
got mine thru an industrial connection, but here:

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/bci-75060


im actually 99% sure it will plug directly in to the harness as well.

Looks nice, I see you bought a "puller" fan, I can't remember if the OEM is a "Puller or Pusher" fan as wired...
And my bike ks buried with no battery, so I can't say...

Also, the new one appears to be a more dense package, you may find that when its not running, the free airflow thru the radiator may be reduced a bit, and cause the need for the fan to run more frequently, but if that cures the issue thumbs up... :great: :great:

Maybe share how you intend to adapt the 3 point mounting brackets from your melted fan chassis to the new one, take pictures....and record the process and measurements during your customization....

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW

Offline m in sc

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2017, 06:58:22 pm »
if its behind the radiator, its a puller.  i'll mess with it soon enough, prob just make a bracket that mount sot the stock points so its a direct bolt in. it should move plenty of air for sure.  ive done a boatload of cars with elec fans and adding one like this never hurt the free airflow through the radiator, but i can see where you are coming from. the best way to do it is actually to make a legit shroud out of sheet aluminum, not sure if im feeling that ambitious though. 

@ grant. daaaamn thats gnarly.  :o

Offline m in sc

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2017, 06:10:05 pm »
so i got the radiator out, pulled the stock fan .. its pretty bad. so, i decided to go with acurved blade 9" fan instead, will use the smalled one for a trans cooler on my maverick


anyway, heres the old fan and the replacement.

the new fan will have the blades sitting about an inch further away fromt he exhaust as the old one, and im going to make some basic heat shields for the inner header pipes.  but over all this should be much better. 

i decided not to make a bracket to mount it, but use the pull thru the fins car style mounting ties.  reason being is i wanted the fan as close to the radiator as possible. i put 4 dabs of silicone on the fan corners under the mount sot avoid any vibration as well.

also, the lower part of the new fan, i cut off about a 3rd of the grill over it to avoid any possible melting issues. it was still further away from the exhaust than the stocker but no harm in trimming it as well.

the 9" fan is this one:
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Spal-Fan-Assembly-9-inch-12V/121499782628?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

i'm going to reseal my waterpump tonight since the system is drained and hopefully wrap it up tonight.


Offline Jim Snyder

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2017, 01:48:23 am »
M,
 Did you have to change the pigtail plug on the new fan or is that a plug and play unit.
"Some days you're the windshield, and some days you're the bug" Get used to it cause thats life !!!

Offline m in sc

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2017, 04:24:19 am »
had to change it on the 9" one. no biggie.

got all this doen tonight, fan fits great, heat shields did job, all good there. resealed water pump but gpz zone didnt send me the mechanical seal.. ( i didnt really know about it, so its on me) which i pushed my luck and reused it.. and... it weeps coolant now.  :'(  pretty severly like not rideable.

im going to try to see if i can get a legit lipped seal for it, that mechanical seal is a pretty crap design on the water side.  has anybody doen this prior?  aside from the bearings and seals being shot, the rest of the pump looked great, better than expected for sure.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2017, 05:19:04 am by m in sc »

Offline Bob_C_CT

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2017, 09:14:50 am »
If you mean it's weeping coolant from the weep hole and the bearings are shot then it's time for a new water pump. The seal on the shaft is for the oil side. Some have dissected the water pump and gave up on rebuilding it.
On the other hand if you are talking about the seal that is on the cover that goes over the impeller than that's a different story. I've made Oring gaskets using round Oring stock off a reel and crazy glued the ends together but not on the water pump as my new one came with the tear drop shaped gasket.
I had to make a custom Oring gasket for work, contacted a local hose seal mfg to buy the Oring making kit. When I talkedto the counter sales person on the kit he said save your money, the kit came with a guillotine type cutter to make a nice even cut that can be achieved with careful cutting with a sharp razor blade and a tube of adhesive that is really just crazy glue.
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Offline Grant

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2017, 09:53:38 am »
had to change it on the 9" one. no biggie.

got all this doen tonight, fan fits great, heat shields did job, all good there. resealed water pump but gpz zone didnt send me the mechanical seal.. ( i didnt really know about it, so its on me) which i pushed my luck and reused it.. and... it weeps coolant now.  :'(  pretty severly like not rideable.

im going to try to see if i can get a legit lipped seal for it, that mechanical seal is a pretty crap design on the water side.  has anybody doen this prior?  aside from the bearings and seals being shot, the rest of the pump looked great, better than expected for sure.
Save yourself the frustration and get a new water pump. Mechanical shaft seals are used in most all types of pump and because they are far superior to a lip seal in most of these applications. However mechanical seals can be very finicky as they rely on lapped surface to seal.
2005 C10, 2016 C14 and a work in progress custom V-TWIN pro Street.

Offline m in sc

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Re: spal fan or source for muzzy fan?
« Reply #17 on: September 14, 2017, 12:08:18 pm »
im tired of messing with it so i have a new pump on way as of this am, its been taking up too much space int he shop the past 4 days. 
had to change it on the 9" one. no biggie.

got all this doen tonight, fan fits great, heat shields did job, all good there. resealed water pump but gpz zone didnt send me the mechanical seal.. ( i didnt really know about it, so its on me) which i pushed my luck and reused it.. and... it weeps coolant now.  :'(  pretty severly like not rideable.

im going to try to see if i can get a legit lipped seal for it, that mechanical seal is a pretty crap design on the water side.  has anybody doen this prior?  aside from the bearings and seals being shot, the rest of the pump looked great, better than expected for sure.
Save yourself the frustration and get a new water pump. Mechanical shaft seals are used in most all types of pump and because they are far superior to a lip seal in most of these applications. However mechanical seals can be very finicky as they rely on lapped surface to seal.