Author Topic: ZZR Alternators  (Read 820 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline connieklr

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 833
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 1608
  • Membership Level: Active
ZZR Alternators
« on: April 21, 2018, 11:21:56 am »
Curious if anyone is (still) running ZZR alternators on their C10s?
________________
Guy Young
COG #1608
COG Life Member
Semi-Civilian
GB Young Services, LLC

Offline fred-houston

  • Officer
  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 956
  • COG Membership Officer
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 9066
  • Membership Level: Administrator
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2018, 12:56:24 pm »
I am, even have another for back-up.
Fred Boothe - COG Membership Officer
Missouri City, TeXaS
1999 C-10 EFI (Semi Naked)
2016 Yamaha Super Tenere

Offline Rob

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 328
  • AREA: Northwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2018, 02:46:59 pm »
I've got one for sale if anyone is interested.  :)

Offline Rain Dancer

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 725
  • Just Ridin' in the rain......
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 10523
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2018, 09:47:13 pm »
Yep, love that upgrade!
"Of course, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong."  Dennis Miller

1997Connie (rip?), 2004 FJR, 1983 xs650, 1980 xs11

Offline frenche

  • Mini Bike
  • **
  • Posts: 150
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 12332
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2018, 10:14:28 pm »
Rob,
I sent you a pm.
frenche

Offline Rev Ryder

  • Officer
  • I Need a Life
  • ****
  • Posts: 8772
  • We came. We saw. We Concours-ed.
    • Presbychuck
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 7235
  • Membership Level: Executive Director
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2018, 11:29:23 pm »
I'm running the whole engine. LOL

And I'm running the alternator on several C-10s.  It IS the big zapper of that gene pool.
Fortis non Ferox
 Shafties Can't Wheelie

Offline who me?

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 712
  • AREA: Southeast Area
  • COG#: 11932
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #6 on: April 22, 2018, 04:06:58 pm »
Did the upgrade last year  :great:
I have no idea about anything.
95 C10 The Mule
02 C10 parts are parts
08 FJR Self identifies as a C13

Offline oldsmoboat

  • Road Bike
  • ***
  • Posts: 442
  • 2004 C10
  • AREA: Southwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2018, 05:30:05 pm »
I am running one.

Offline VTconnie

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1607
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 11081
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2018, 10:28:35 pm »
Any advantage if you don't run high wattage gear?
<--2003 Concours C-10 "Conifer", -AKA- The Cruise Missile
1980 CB900C DOHC "Old Iron" -AKA- The Hill Climber                

Offline Rev Ryder

  • Officer
  • I Need a Life
  • ****
  • Posts: 8772
  • We came. We saw. We Concours-ed.
    • Presbychuck
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 7235
  • Membership Level: Executive Director
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #9 on: April 22, 2018, 10:40:57 pm »
Any advantage if you don't run high wattage gear?
If you run lots of lighting or other juice hungry stuff then yeah, there's an advantage.  If you have nothing more than stock and don;t run electric gear or driving lights, then no, it's not at all necessary.  But if you go in for GPS, sound systems, heated anything, driving lights (non-LED), or other gizmos (or EFI) then you'll certainly appreciate the extra amperage support to run it all.
Fortis non Ferox
 Shafties Can't Wheelie

Offline VTconnie

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1607
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 11081
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2018, 07:09:22 pm »
Any advantage if you don't run high wattage gear?
If you run lots of lighting or other juice hungry stuff then yeah, there's an advantage.  If you have nothing more than stock and don;t run electric gear or driving lights, then no, it's not at all necessary.  But if you go in for GPS, sound systems, heated anything, driving lights (non-LED), or other gizmos (or EFI) then you'll certainly appreciate the extra amperage support to run it all.

Nice, I had a 240 amp alternator built for my F-250 when the original crapped out. As fun as it would be to juice the Connie, if it aint broke...
<--2003 Concours C-10 "Conifer", -AKA- The Cruise Missile
1980 CB900C DOHC "Old Iron" -AKA- The Hill Climber                

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 8015
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 5977
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #11 on: April 23, 2018, 09:11:51 pm »
Any advantage if you don't run high wattage gear?
If you run lots of lighting or other juice hungry stuff then yeah, there's an advantage.  If you have nothing more than stock and don;t run electric gear or driving lights, then no, it's not at all necessary.  But if you go in for GPS, sound systems, heated anything, driving lights (non-LED), or other gizmos (or EFI) then you'll certainly appreciate the extra amperage support to run it all.

Nice, I had a 240 amp alternator built for my F-250 when the original crapped out. As fun as it would be to juice the Connie, if it aint broke...

Yeah, but even the stock system needs a lot of inspecting periodically.. iv repced at least a dozen harness connections from the OEM alternator on these bikes since 2003... some melted down, some where in the process of melting, and some just needed "attention"..
When you stick a pair of driving lights on the bike, and raise the OEM headlight bulb upto a NAPA 80/100, and add in Gerbing jacket, its gonna melt the 2 blade nylon connector from the alternator, to the main harness, for sure, on an old bike that has "resistive" invisible coating on the blades in that plug... BT/DT...
It ain't fun on the side of the road, 300 miles from home, cutting and scabbing in connections while cannableizing your harness when it happens..

I agree, the ZzR charger is a nice feature, but even the stock one needs to be inspected, and the plugs need occasional "cleaning/exercising" by unplugging, and replugging them in every couple years.. as a prevention to the meltdown..

I know the O/P can attest to my story/dealings with this, as he was disappearing in the distance, on the way back from RWTW, as mine fried out... he was pretty freaked out by it when he returned to see what happened, but I was already in "cut and splice mode" at that point... :great:

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW
and if you are gonna call me names... it's MR. Analdweeb if you please...

Offline Nosmo

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1925
  • "We're all in this together" -- Red Green
  • AREA: Northwest Area
  • COG#: Forum
  • Membership Level: Forum Subscriber
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #12 on: April 23, 2018, 11:18:40 pm »
Yep, my stock alternator plug melted so I soldered the wires together.  I can't for the life of me see a reason for a quick-disconnect plug on an alternator that will get removed/installed maybe once on the life of the bike.
2003 Connie    2007 Wee-Strom   

"What could possibly go wrong...click....go wrong...click...go wrong...click...go wrong..."

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 8015
  • AREA: North Central Area
  • COG#: 5977
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #13 on: April 23, 2018, 11:27:53 pm »
Its all based on the assembly..... dude...

My generic fix is a solder job, attaching 2 x 14awg wires to each lead, and crimping on 2 new insulated blade connections to both sides of the "now removed" melted connector..  doubling the connection points effectively, as the rating for 30amps excedes a single blade connection, especially when its oxydised..

30 YEARS OF KAW.....Rich R. (the other one..)  COG 5977  JUSTAMEMBAHNOW
and if you are gonna call me names... it's MR. Analdweeb if you please...

Offline VTconnie

  • Crotch Rocket
  • ****
  • Posts: 1607
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 11081
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2018, 12:08:18 am »
I learned on my truck that there are always improvements to be made over stock. The old Honda CB's have a reputation for cooking connections for the same reasons, 38 year old corroded blade connectors that melt down under load. Also the bike's electrical output from the factory was scarcely enough from the get-go, idling or running under 3000 RPM the battery isn't even charging! The alternator winding's insulation is also prone to break down and short, and replacement parts are getting tough to find. Some companies have been making replacement windings, with mixed results. That and 1500 mile oil change intervals, make the Honda more of a novelty than a commuter. Ahh old air cooleds..
« Last Edit: April 24, 2018, 12:11:33 am by VTconnie »
<--2003 Concours C-10 "Conifer", -AKA- The Cruise Missile
1980 CB900C DOHC "Old Iron" -AKA- The Hill Climber                

Offline Bob_C_CT

  • Sport Tourer
  • *****
  • Posts: 2051
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 9544
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2018, 01:32:52 pm »
I have a ZZR alternator on the shelf. Didn’t come with the 2 wire leads. I purchased a plug that connects to the 3 plus on the alternator and now have 3 wires. I was going to make a test stand to see what the 3 outputs do before splicing begins. Has anyone worked with the 3 wires before? and know what they are. I don’t want to fry anything out. I’m thinking I only need 2 of them to splice together. They must put out a charge to trigger the relay.
97 C10,ZRX Front, Meanstreak rim

Offline WillyP

  • I Need a Life
  • ******
  • Posts: 6096
  • Live Free Or Die
    • Suncook Carpentry
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 8799
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #16 on: April 24, 2018, 06:47:09 pm »
There are instructions here: http://www.delp.net/Concours/ Look in the left column for "Alternator Mod".
Smart people look like crazy people to stupid people.
pics

Offline Bob_C_CT

  • Sport Tourer
  • *****
  • Posts: 2051
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 9544
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #17 on: April 25, 2018, 11:51:30 am »
Those are good instructions, the problem is step 9 says to connect the 2 wires together from the ZZR alternator, which is the stock wiring from kawi. The one I bought was missing this stock wire and plug that is either 3 into 2 wire or just 2 pins on the 3 pin outlet on the alternator are used.
97 C10,ZRX Front, Meanstreak rim

Offline Rev Ryder

  • Officer
  • I Need a Life
  • ****
  • Posts: 8772
  • We came. We saw. We Concours-ed.
    • Presbychuck
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 7235
  • Membership Level: Executive Director
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #18 on: April 25, 2018, 03:19:10 pm »
IIRC
Delp's instructions are that ALL FOUR wires (the three in the harness AND the larger red charging wire) can be brought together as one to the relay.  This is NOT the only way to wire these alternators up, but it is a reasonable and simple way of doing it.  The relay is then "fired" or "turned on" by a wire that is hot when ignition is on.  This will provide the excitement the alternator needs and it will charge back through the 50 amp relay.  When the switch is off, that contact is all broken again and protects the alternator and the battery from damage/discharge. 

Alas for the wiring harness, they are available in the aftermarket.  Fred Boothe found them (I do not recall where) but they are a Ford part number and run under $10 on Amazon or eBay or wherever he found them.  He could probably provide the answer or I could go look at one I have in the shop cabinet somewhere and find the info.  Maybe. Perhaps.  Or not.  I'll probably forget before I get that far back in the shop.   :rotflmao:

EDIT TO ADD: The stock harness has the ree wires from the three pins consolidated into one wire.  IIRC again, that one wire COULD be hooked to the brown wire that goes to the stock alternator.  The white wire on the bike would connect to the charge post wire.  Either that or the other way around, but I think that's right without looking.  However, I would suggest NOT doing it that way for a couple of reasons, but mainly because the  white wire is woefully inadequate for a 50 amp circuit, it does only a fair job with the stock alternator output.  BUT that charge post wire COULD be connected (through a fuse no relay required) to the battery or battery post on the starter solenoid and the white wire simply not used at all.  This reuses the brown wire to provide alternator stimulus when switched on (this would also be the wire to run Delp's relay circuit) and the charging would then be handled similar to stock, but with larger wire and a fuse for safety (that the bike does not have stock).
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 03:29:01 pm by Rev Ryder »
Fortis non Ferox
 Shafties Can't Wheelie

Offline Rev Ryder

  • Officer
  • I Need a Life
  • ****
  • Posts: 8772
  • We came. We saw. We Concours-ed.
    • Presbychuck
  • AREA: South Central Area
  • COG#: 7235
  • Membership Level: Executive Director
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #19 on: April 25, 2018, 03:31:36 pm »
I have a ZZR alternator on the shelf. Didn’t come with the 2 wire leads. I purchased a plug that connects to the 3 plus on the alternator and now have 3 wires. I was going to make a test stand to see what the 3 outputs do before splicing begins. Has anyone worked with the 3 wires before? and know what they are. I don’t want to fry anything out. I’m thinking I only need 2 of them to splice together. They must put out a charge to trigger the relay.
Sorry I posted before reading completely.  You will consolidate the three leads in the harness together to become "one" wire.  The second wire will be the charge post wire.  Follow Delp's instructions from there and enjoy.

EDIT AGAIN TO ADD: A picture.  Here's exactly what Delp's instructions will lead you to.  Just like this.  Not the only way, but it works.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 03:36:35 pm by Rev Ryder »
Fortis non Ferox
 Shafties Can't Wheelie

Offline connieklr

  • Street Cruiser
  • ****
  • Posts: 833
  • AREA: Northeast Area
  • COG#: 1608
  • Membership Level: Active
Re: ZZR Alternators
« Reply #20 on: April 25, 2018, 05:17:17 pm »
I was just curious.

Someone gave me one a long time ago, but he had cooked it. Know the rotor is toast (~$450), and potentially the regulator (~$456). Ditto that for the diode a**'y). I no longer need the ampacity, and this one just ain't worth putting out the bux on.

I worked up the relay disconnect scheme for a fella way back when these were the hot topic, but never pursued getting my own working; too many uncertain bux on the line.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 06:29:45 pm by connieklr »
________________
Guy Young
COG #1608
COG Life Member
Semi-Civilian
GB Young Services, LLC