Author Topic: Spun the rear in the rain  (Read 920 times)

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Offline Salish14

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Spun the rear in the rain
« on: March 05, 2018, 11:50:32 pm »
So on this wet and cool day today I'm going along and hit a quiet stretch of road. Came off the stop sign and while going about 15 I twisted the throttle a bit for fun, like I've done a million times. Bike revs up and before I hit 25, still in first gear, the rear wheel pops free, spins up and I had that moment of Oh s***. Rear end wiggles off line. Stayed calm and rolled off slowly, and no drama. I've never been able to pop that wheel loose before while already moving, but the rain and road, and maybe some unseen oil, and wham. Ride PR4's, so good tires but not racing tires. Glad it was over in an instant and didn't result in me doing the flying monkey routine!
We sit together, the mountain and me, until only the mountain remains.

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Offline ZXtasy

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2018, 01:00:33 am »
Dont these things have traction control?
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Offline Salish14

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2018, 01:15:33 am »
Not my 08! ABS but no traction control.
We sit together, the mountain and me, until only the mountain remains.

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Offline ZXtasy

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2018, 01:10:30 pm »
I love my old school Zed-Ex_Ten, (05) for the lack of any electronic interventions...slides, whoolies, butt puckers....all readily available!
2013 ZG-1400, 2005 ZX-10R (Nekkid), 2012 TW-200, 1999 TW-200....and more to come.

Offline KevinRLI

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2018, 01:57:09 pm »
Yeah I had the back tire slip on my 2015 C14 with traction control...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6Wvb2q1zQc

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Offline Salish14

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2018, 05:28:23 pm »
Wow, Kevin, I watched your video and am glad you looked fine. What happened? It was icy, but I don't see ice on the road. You were speeding up to merge and get ahead, but were you rolling on hard? Looks like a mystery fall on the video to me.
We sit together, the mountain and me, until only the mountain remains.

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Offline Pittsburgh_Clem

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2018, 11:33:50 pm »
Yeah I had the back tire slip on my 2015 C14 with traction control...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6Wvb2q1zQc


 :-\ And once again that's why I don't have a camera  and you changed your name
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Offline gsun

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2018, 11:54:17 pm »
Looks like it might have broken out when you crossed the white line. Probably ice on it. Thanks for ATGATT!

Offline KevinRLI

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #8 on: March 07, 2018, 10:51:32 am »
Wow, Kevin, I watched your video and am glad you looked fine. What happened? It was icy, but I don't see ice on the road. You were speeding up to merge and get ahead, but were you rolling on hard? Looks like a mystery fall on the video to me.


Yeah you learn just a little more each day.. Ha... That was January 10th 2017. You can barely see a little dark streak running in between the lanes. That was black ice. When I got up to the point of going from lane 1 to lane 2 that dark streak was pretty much gone. I wasn't rolling on hard when I made the lane change but it was hard enough that when I went over the white line that must of had just a bit of ice left on it the tire broke traction. Rear kicked left and then right and over I went. The only proper gear I didn't have on were the right pants. I was wearing Levi's with just a pair of thermals underneath. I ended up getting 2" diameter of road rash on each knee. That was it. My Sedici jacket absorbed all the impact on my forearms and back. My Bilt gloves wore all the way through on my fingers. Will never buy those again. My helmet didn't have a scratch on it. Nothing. The bike had 7k in damage and I rode it home from the dealer 13 days later.

Anyway traction control didn't have time to do squat for me! Ha.. I continue to ride in cold weather and take it very easy when I do. I rode in very similar conditions just a few days ago and every time I changed lanes I accelerated in my lane and when committed to changing I pulled the clutch while passing the white lines and darker parts of the road. A little older and hopefully a little wiser :)


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Offline Daytona_Mike

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #9 on: March 07, 2018, 01:35:48 pm »
White line/ice may have contributed (not really) but more likely the tires were still cold and not warmed up yet plus 'Dead Sticking' the throttle was the biggest contributor (engine rev'ed out to about redline) and then chopping the throttle closed was the final nail in the coffin.

What tire/tire size are  are you running in the rear  and what pressure are you running? The pressure readout on the dash is great for knowing if your tires are still cold and not warmed up yet.

It is all about throttle control. Pulling in the clutch? - another unsafe  idea.  I would bet you dont have Steve's flash on your bike.
 I have gotten caught in snow storms on my CB750 when I lived up north. You learn throttle control real quick especially going up a hill. Going down steep hills was the hardest part. :)



 
« Last Edit: March 07, 2018, 01:47:18 pm by Daytona_Mike »
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Offline KevinRLI

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2018, 02:38:08 pm »
White line/ice may have contributed (not really) but more likely the tires were still cold and not warmed up yet plus 'Dead Sticking' the throttle was the biggest contributor (engine rev'ed out to about redline) and then chopping the throttle closed was the final nail in the coffin.

What tire/tire size are  are you running in the rear  and what pressure are you running? The pressure readout on the dash is great for knowing if your tires are still cold and not warmed up yet.

It is all about throttle control. Pulling in the clutch? - another unsafe  idea.  I would bet you dont have Steve's flash on your bike.
 I have gotten caught in snow storms on my CB750 when I lived up north. You learn throttle control real quick especially going up a hill. Going down steep hills was the hardest part. :)



 

White line/ice may have contributed (not really) but more likely the tires were still cold and not warmed up yet plus 'Dead Sticking' the throttle was the biggest contributor (engine rev'ed out to about redline) and then chopping the throttle closed was the final nail in the coffin.

What tire/tire size are  are you running in the rear  and what pressure are you running? The pressure readout on the dash is great for knowing if your tires are still cold and not warmed up yet.

It is all about throttle control. Pulling in the clutch? - another unsafe  idea.  I would bet you dont have Steve's flash on your bike.
 I have gotten caught in snow storms on my CB750 when I lived up north. You learn throttle control real quick especially going up a hill. Going down steep hills was the hardest part. :)
 

I love people who have no clue what they're talking about and just spout wisdom like it's the gospel.

Tires were cold.... Hrm... How do you know? How far did I travel before my accident? Even in cold weather traveling at 55 tires would be warm in a couple of miles. I had traveled 15 before the accident... So yeah 1st thing you're wrong about...

Did you view this on a phone or small PC screen? I have this video in full 1080 HD and watched it many times on a 55" LED TV. You can clearly see a dark line of "moisture" in between the lanes As I'm coming up the ramp. Moving from the ramp to lane 1 I was traveling at 50MPH. As I moved to lane 2 I accelerated from 55MPH to 60MPH. Drivers Ed 101 tells you to always accelerate slightly when changing lanes. I did not dead stick it or nail it or anything else except accelerate from 55 to 60... When the tire went from traction to absolutely zero traction going over that icy white line the bike rev'd. Ultimately it was absolutely my mistake for not seeing the ice on that lane. Your assumption that I was doing this or that is just clueless.

Chopping the throttle closed... Yeah that kind of happens when your hand leave said throttle.

Tires... Because I'd have no idea what rubber to put on my C14... Pr4's front and rear. 55 rear 42PSI front and rear.

Pulling the clutch.. Playing Monday morning QB sure... Shoula coulda woulda... Bottom line is that you couldn't even see ice in the video... I was not expecting to hit ice on a single 3" wide 3' long line I just happened to be lucky enough to hit. It was absolutely the reason the tire broke traction.

Oh and your last great assumption. You lost that bet. I have a full muzzy exhaust and Steve's flash for it. So yeah... Wrong again there Einstein...

I posted the video many times to both these forums and the COG FB page to educate people. ATGATT, never assume the winter roads are all clear and last but not least if you don't have a clue maybe it's better to not make a fool out of yourself.... 

1980 Honda CB650 RIP....
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Offline Daytona_Mike

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #11 on: March 07, 2018, 07:21:22 pm »
hehe, Easy there.. Did not man to get your undies in a bunch.  No problem and thanks for answering my questions.
No hard feelings here. If your at 42 in normal weather or room temperature then the pressure should have dropped in the cold which would be a good thing.
I dont  run those pressures even  in Florida weather- I like the bigger contact patch with~ 38 -40 because I could see my tires not warming up at 42 -42. I also prefer the bigger contact patch with the 50 - i tried the 55 and did not like it- 50 for me - more center tire contacting  the road.
The 15 miles does not mean they are warm yet . Like i said  you can use the remote tire  pressure gauges for reference  as the tires warm up your looking for up to 10% pressure increase for warmed up tires. That way you know for sure.
Glad you got Steve's flash.. that helps with  On-Off throttle response big time.
Sorry you got offended - no intention of doing so
You certainly have  really good tires- the best  Flash and a really good exhaust setup. :beerchug:


« Last Edit: March 07, 2018, 07:25:40 pm by Daytona_Mike »
Normally aspirated engines have perpetual turbo lag
2000 Red C10 1052 kit
2008  C14 Silver Dammit Full AreaP- Flies are put back in SISF_Flash
2011  KLR650   688 piston ported and polished
2011  KTM 530    This thing is FUN!!

Offline ZXtasy

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #12 on: March 07, 2018, 07:28:41 pm »
I'll bet your undies were not only bunched, but maybe not so clean after that little OOPS.
Thanks for manning up and sharing, it can be a learning experience for all, even those Floridians who think that anyone riding in temps under 40 and especially if snow or ice are even visible makes you "stoopid, crazy, or both."

I have ridden bikes hundreds of miles in snow and have never had a drop....yet. Not my preferred way to ride mind you, but always good for a lesson and potential story.
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Offline Deepsea

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #13 on: March 07, 2018, 08:16:38 pm »
Traction control and ABS are the very reasons I keep my 09 C14. It doesn't have either one so I will never become dependent on them or complacent. Not saying anyone is and if you like ABS/Traction Control that's great. I find them to be a limiting factor to how I ride.
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Offline gsun

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2018, 02:58:35 am »
^^ True that. I do not have ABS and have locked up the rear tire a couple of times and it teaches you to not be so hard on the rear - more on the front. ABS would not teach that. However, in a panic stop ABS would be nice. Don't have linked brakes either. Don't think I would like that.

Offline Jerdurr

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #15 on: March 20, 2018, 06:49:46 pm »
I'll bet your undies were not only bunched, but maybe not so clean after that little OOPS.
Thanks for manning up and sharing, it can be a learning experience for all, even those Floridians who think that anyone riding in temps under 40 and especially if snow or ice are even visible makes you "stoopid, crazy, or both."

I have ridden bikes hundreds of miles in snow and have never had a drop....yet. Not my preferred way to ride mind you, but always good for a lesson and potential story.

Interested to read someone riding "in snow"... Living in Ontario and being eager to ride, I took my bike out one April a few years back, and got caught in a surprise snow blizzard! Luckily, I went super slow and got where i needed to go safely, but it was a light snow all things considered, and I know for sure I would not be able to do the same in the middle of the winter (not only ice, but add slush, and salt to the mix)....
I wonder if it is a Buffalo winter you are able to ride in, or Georgia :-)
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Offline 4Bikes

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Re: Spun the rear in the rain
« Reply #16 on: March 20, 2018, 09:53:46 pm »
I have ridden a road bike and a mountain bike in the snow to work for years, this year too many times. It’s interesting how much traction you have. That said, there is no way I would consider riding my C-14 in the snow.  I’m think it’s because of the speed, the lean angle and stopping?  I can fall off my bike and not feel too bad about it.  Bigger deal on the C-14!
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