Author Topic: "This Flash is Better"... comparing flashes  (Read 526 times)

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Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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"This Flash is Better"... comparing flashes
« on: July 12, 2018, 03:55:45 pm »
 “ This flash is better”... we all want to make the best choice for ourselves, but most folks don't understand that just like picking the bike you ride, there isn't a “one flash fits all” solution when it comes to tuning. Just because someone says “this flash is better” doesn't mean it's better for the way you ride. And in the end, all that matters is that you make the best choice for yourself... after all, you're paying for it.

    After 3 years of flashing c-14's  and almost 700 Concours flashed, with tons of customer feedback via conversation and reviews, I'd like to share some thoughts on this.

    First of all, flashing in and of itself is evolving. As more techniques are developed, more accessibility to the ecu is gained, and most of all customer feedback is considered, the art improves. Each year I've offered upgrades and updates.  This is important to bear in mind, because I will readily say that my current flashes clearly outshine my Original Flash, the Decel Flash, the original Area P Full System Flash and even the Evolution Flash.  If any of these flashes would be compared to Mountain Runner, The Classic, or the new Areas P flashes, the improvements will be immediately noticeable. Therefore it would be natural to say that my most current offerings are the best tunes I've ever offered for the c-14

    Now how about comparing my most current flashes? They are both targeted to different riders. Why?  Let's compare.

    Mountain Runner and the Classic are both great flashes, and ultimately make the same power (152 HP).  Yet they will be polarizing in who prefers each flash, depending on what's important to them as a rider. The primary difference is below 10% throttle. Mountain Runner has somewhat muted throttle response and improved engine braking below 10% throttle. The Classic gives you all the power available at any given point in the throttle, from the very first degree of throttle opening.

    Why is up to 10% throttle important?  Because the c-14 has such a large and powerful engine, you would be amazed at how much riding can be done under 10% throttle. For instance, on my c-14 with a large windscreen and bags I can hold 80mph on the level interstate with 9 to 10% throttle.  Think about that for a minute. Most of our average light throttle tooling around is being done under 10% throttle.

    This sets up an obvious point for comparison. Mountain Runner may feel less responsive to some folks. In this area, the Classic will clearly seem more aggressive and impressive power -wise.  Mountain Runner has a “kitten and tiger” personality... when you're light on the throttle you'ld never know the c-14 is as powerful as it is. Scroll the throttle up and it's all there. Classic just begs for more throttle. Some would say the engine feels “freed up, like it's not fighting itself”. Very throttle responsive at light throttle means your brain will think it's ultimately stronger than the Mountain Runner. Not so.

    If you were to compare both flashes in a non – technical or familiar riding environment, The Classic will CLEARLY be more impressive. Pop the ECU in your bike, and take that fist ride around your block and immediate riding area that you are familiar with. WOW. Do the same with the Mountain Runner, you may feel the Classic is the better flash.  Even to me,  a ride around the block with the Classic is certainly more impressive. Its willingness to accelerate with almost no throttle application is intoxicating.

  Now take the comparison to some technical or unfamiliar roads, and almost every rider except the most aggressive will find the bike easier to control with Mountain Runner
. Think about that. This is where the finite throttle control and engine braking shine. Curve entrance speeds are set using throttle moreso than brakes. Less braking means a smoother rider. Powering out is more controllable due to the the improved throttle control. The guys who pushed me to develop Mountain Runner knew exactly what they wanted, and why.

   I can ride whatever flash I want, yet I keep Mountain Runner in my own C-14. I am more confident with it while technical riding and when on roads I haven't ridden before as I don't know what to expect from curves and turns I've never been on previously.

   The point here is that not everyone wants the same thing, but I am offering choices to the c-14 owner. Pick the tuning YOU PREFER FOR WHAT IMPRESSES YOU. Then you will clearly have “the better flash”.

   Please keep in mind that if you have an older flash that's been discontinued, I have updates and upgrades available.   Updates are free to the original purchasers, just cover the shipping costs. Upgrades are 75.00 which include shipping costs.

  Currently I have updates for the full System Area P flash, and the Original flash may be updated to the Classic Flash. Mountain Runner or the Classic flash would be available upgrades for those with the Original, Decel, or the Evolution Flash.

  I hope folks understand my intent is to give the most up to date products, the best service, and the most choices to my customers. I work hard at bettering my products based on your feedback because your satisfaction is important to me. Thanks for all the support you've give to Shoodaben Engineering over all these years.

 Steve

 
« Last Edit: July 12, 2018, 07:24:07 pm by Steve in Sunny Fla »
C-14 ECU flashing for performance and rideability enhancement
C-10 Carb work , cams, & performance enhancements
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Offline DC Concours

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Re: "This Flash is Better"... comparing flashes
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2018, 04:35:29 pm »
Are you all done impressing the C10 owners? Is there anyway to get more power in second gear in traffic maneuvering?

Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: "This Flash is Better"... comparing flashes
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2018, 05:06:04 pm »
Are you all done impressing the C10 owners? Is there anyway to get more power in second gear in traffic maneuvering?

 maybe use 1st gear? Maybe break down and get a c-14?  It's getting ridiculous how cheap they are on the used market, and despite the best efforts of Dan Bergmen, Rev Rider, Jim Snyder, myself of the myriad of c-10 hotrodders none of us can make a c-10 based bike be what a c-14 can be.  >:D  Steve
C-14 ECU flashing for performance and rideability enhancement
C-10 Carb work , cams, & performance enhancements
 " Modifications for sport-tourers, BY a sport-tourer"
https://sites.google.com/site/shoodabenengineering/home

Offline ghostrider990

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Re: "This Flash is Better"... comparing flashes
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2018, 10:46:11 am »
Well Put Steve.

The fact that you are constantly reevaluating your own product, how you "market" it, and defining it, simply proves that you are a conscientious and thoughtful businessman.

And so this doesn't sound like I got a free flash from Steve for my kind thoughts, I'm a paying customer, just like the rest of you!  :))

This post was borne of an ongoing conversation I've been having with Steve, trying to find the best flash for MY setup and MY riding style.  The more we talked, the more we BOTH realized - it's not the tune, it's ME and how I perceive what the bike is doing as a result of the tune.
And to be fair - he doesn't have a specific tune for MY setup yet (zx14 headers with slip ons).
I literally had to talk him into LETTING me buy his flash from him!!!  :beerchug:

It really is true that personal factors come into play when evaluating Steve's tunes.  So many variables, and so many different riding styles, and bike setups.
In the end, we all have to be honest with ourselves and truly examine how we ride on a daily basis, and what the goals are for our riding style.

The real beauty is, we have multiple options, and those weren't available just a few years ago.

Even though I haven't been able to get my bike on Steve's Dyno for a custom tune/flash, running a Modified AreaP flash is WAAAAAAY better than what I had before.

We are all old enough to remember what it took to get a few extra HP out of Carburated bikes, right?
Let's collectively breathe and realize how easy it is to simply unplug our ECU's, ship 'em to Steve, and in two days, have a completely different animal at our disposal!  :great:

carry on

gr



..."I like to keep this handy -- for Close Encounters"...

Offline freebird6

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Re: "This Flash is Better"... comparing flashes
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2018, 09:40:27 pm »
Guarantee I still love my original Decel flash but it is gonna get upgraded to the Mountain Runner this fall when it comes time to put the bike away for it's long sleep.

Offline Road Runner

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Re: "This Flash is Better"... comparing flashes
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2018, 01:25:40 am »
Thanks Steve for sharing this info. It was helpful !
David L. Hamil
Athens/Decatur/Huntsvile, AL area
'13 ZG1400 "Metallic Spark Black"

Offline Jim Snyder

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Re: "This Flash is Better"... comparing flashes
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2018, 04:24:31 pm »
Are you all done impressing the C10 owners? Is there anyway to get more power in second gear in traffic maneuvering?

 maybe use 1st gear? Maybe break down and get a c-14?  It's getting ridiculous how cheap they are on the used market, and despite the best efforts of Dan Bergmen, Rev Rider, Jim Snyder, myself of the myriad of c-10 hotrodders none of us can make a c-10 based bike be what a c-14 can be.  >:D  Steve

But we had fun trying !!!
"Some days you're the windshield, and some days you're the bug" Get used to it cause thats life !!!

Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: "This Flash is Better"... comparing flashes
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2018, 10:32:29 am »

But we had fun trying !!!


  Yes, absolutely!  To me that was a special time in COG, all of the exploration, discovery, and sharing. Great comraderie.  Certainly "the good old days".  Steve
C-14 ECU flashing for performance and rideability enhancement
C-10 Carb work , cams, & performance enhancements
 " Modifications for sport-tourers, BY a sport-tourer"
https://sites.google.com/site/shoodabenengineering/home