Author Topic: Front end shake after replacing front tire (Read 1590 times)

Steve · « **on:** February 23, 2019, 08:34:23 pm »

Just like to get some opinions on this. I just had a Contimotion tire installed on the front. The front end now shakes. When you let go of handlebars at 50 or less it starts shaking really bad. I went back and loosed pinch bolts on axle and retightened axle. Still same. Has 42 lbs air, mounted and balanced by professional tire place. I think the tire has some bad cords in it. The old tire was scalloped out bad and still was better than this one. I bought both front and rear on Amazon in November. Just got front one on day Wednesday. So i guess there will be no replacement for me.
Anybody ever had any experience with Continental tires?

gpd323 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 23, 2019, 08:47:10 pm »

Thats what I get when I ran the AVON 3DXM's, all 3 sets had a terrible head shake. All the tires before I used never an issue specifically the Pirellis.. I installed some new Dunlops RS3's and no head shake at all. Went away after the AVON's came off.

I will say for sure its just the tire, not anything else.

Interestingly, AVON has a rebate going on for the new Spirit tires. I bought an new set. I suspect the head shake will return.

I just never let go of the bars running the AVON's. Its was obnoxious but I could deal with it.

Charliedog · « **Reply #2 on:** February 23, 2019, 09:36:12 pm »

Just a thought. When I ran the Avon Azarro's (sp?) on my C10 there was a low speed head shake that went away above 30 mph. I found out after replacing the tires they might have accentuated loose steering head bearings-at least compared to other brands/models of tires. Have you checked you steering head bearings.

I just ordered a set of Spirit ST's-couldn't resist the price including rebate. I hope history doesn't repeat itself.

Steve · « **Reply #3 on:** February 23, 2019, 10:01:04 pm »

I replaced steering head bearings in Roadstar i had. They had lot of rust. These seem pretty snug and good even feel when you turn. I could turn loose handle bars and stretch going above 50. I wont now. Sometimes you just get a bad tire. My friend has front end shop. Lot of folks come in thinking fromt end is out of alignment or bad parts but after they put bad tire on back or replace they can tell.

MAN OF BLUES · « **Reply #4 on:** February 23, 2019, 10:12:37 pm »

Quote from: Charliedog on February 23, 2019, 09:36:12 pm

Just a thought. When I ran the Avon Azarro's (sp?) on my C10 there was a low speed head shake that went away above 30 mph. I found out after replacing the tires they might have accentuated loose steering head bearings-at least compared to other brands/models of tires. Have you checked you steering head bearings.

I just ordered a set of Spirit ST's-couldn't resist the price including rebate. I hope history doesn't repeat itself.

different bike and bearing effect altogether.. common on C10, very uncommon on the C14....
likely the "online" tire may be defective.
I only buy tire from reliable tire sources... they will stand behind the products.

Put the bike on the centertand, and lift the front using blocks under the engine.
Tape some cardboard strips to the fender to use as a "runout indicator" and spin the tire, see if it goes side to side, or is egg shaped around it's circumference..

also, while it's supported, loosen the pinch bolts again, tap a flat blade screwdriver into each fork's "split" at the pinch bolts (and leave them there to inure they are not pinching the axle tightly), spin the tire and clamp the front brakes on... repeat this a dozen or so times, then remove the screwdrivers and re-tighten the pinch bolts...
this "helps" centralize the wheel/axle assembly.

Steve · « **Reply #5 on:** February 23, 2019, 10:39:14 pm »

My brakes drag so bad this is hard to do. I would have to crack the bleeders probably. Then probaby 2 hours trying to get air out. I have a couple of speed bleeders for a Roadstar. I might see if they will work on this one.
Right now im going to see if i can get another tire. Its been raining about all Feb here. Tonight we are under tornado watch. May not even have to worry about it after tonight.

MAN OF BLUES · « **Reply #6 on:** February 23, 2019, 11:25:54 pm »

Quote from: Steve on February 23, 2019, 10:39:14 pm

My brakes drag so bad this is hard to do. I would have to crack the bleeders probably. Then probaby 2 hours trying to get air out. I have a couple of speed bleeders for a Roadstar. I might see if they will work on this one.
......

hmmmmmmmmmm

soooooo, might this be an issue????

you don't have to"crack bleeders" simply stick a screwdriver in there and pry them off the disk...gently.. and lightly... untill they don't rub.. they should never be dragging on the disc enough to prevent free spinning (by hand) rotation.

as for WHY they are dragging... well, I suggest a good cleaning of those pistons "exposed surfaces" before pushing them gently in, with BrakeKleen Spray and an old toothbrush, before things get too bad...
Natural runout on the disc should "bump" the pad enough to make them NEVER be riding on the disc enough to "spin" the wheel freely... you have further thing now to look into, and thank you for making that statement about them, as "little things" like this are vary telling, and important..
Don't bother playing with "speed bleeder install" now, to remedy a problem that is not related to the issue.

with all of that said... a NEW tire will often show/make present things that transpired, and went unknown...

like maybe;

Quote from: Steve on February 23, 2019, 08:34:23 pm

The old tire was scalloped out bad and still was better than this one. I bought both front and rear on Amazon in November. Just got front one on day Wednesday. So i guess there will be no replacement for me.....

not saying it was the cause for the older tire's demise, but I'm sure it didn't help to have dragging brake pads... Like Charlie mentioned relative to the C10, which was notorious for "headshake right after a new tire install", the NEW (C10) tire told the tale of why the old tire, even scalloped never had a"headshake" issue... only when a proper NEW tire was installed did the bearing reveal itself.. again, C14 head bearings are NOT the same, so not an indicator for an issue revealed by a new tire install. The brake thing however, should be dealt with...

best of luck, ride safe...

Steve · « **Reply #7 on:** February 24, 2019, 01:18:08 am »

Just looked on my Amazon account. I bought front, rear for 160.00. Date was 10/30/18. ATV Outfitters was seller. Just looked on their site and didnt even show M/C tires. After that long theres no way they will make it up.
Noticed sticker on side of Concours. Seem like it said Dunlop tires. Guess thats what come on it new. Anyone tried Dunlop Sportmax GPR 300?
Im not going neck bearing as cause. Its not loose and turns freely. I'll sell it before i go through changing out a set of them again. My Roadstar looked like a bad head on wreck when i tore it down to do that. Its a major PITA changing out those races. Plus having to put in All Balls Chinese bearings.
One thing for sure ever who owns it now wont have to worry about it. It has a grease fitting in the neck and is full of waterproof wheel bearing grease.
The brake pads are probably not seated good after i pryed them apart to get front wheel back on without having to remove them. Only rode a few miles . It needs couple 100 mph hard stops.

MAN OF BLUES · « **Reply #8 on:** February 24, 2019, 03:58:23 am »

Please read what I said...

I said I DON'T think it has do do with your bearings, nor did I say to mess with them...

as for installing a grease fitting in the steering neck, and pumping it FULL of grease? I cannot comment. I see no reason why anyone would do that. That, in my opinion, was not needed or recommended for normal conditions. You should have asked around here prior to doing that, as I don't think anyone would have recommended that.

I did speak about the brake caliper pistons, and the cleaning of them, and your explanation of "prying them" prior, also leads me to believe they were dirty, and that action did in fact do what I feared, and cautioned about.. shoving the dirty externally exposed portion of the pistons in, and now the seal with that dirt, is preventing smooth retraction of the pads, during normal operation.

gpd323 · « **Reply #9 on:** February 24, 2019, 02:05:51 pm »

I also use 2 screwdrivers to pry the pads wide so I can reinstall them, especially when installing new pads. I tell ya though, its the new front tire thats causing the head shake.

I have GPR300's on the Z900RS that came on it new. Decent tire for that bike but not going to replace them with the same when the RS tires wear out.

Steve · « **Reply #10 on:** February 24, 2019, 02:59:07 pm »

I know they wont make up this tire. If they do i will give them 5 stars. I wonder if I drive it more if it will get any better?
If any of you buy tires from Amazon or Ebay dont wait about putting them on like I did. Amazon and Ebay both have been good about exchanges. Simple job turns into week of week and frustration.
Thanks for all the input.

gpd323 · « **Reply #11 on:** February 24, 2019, 03:26:49 pm »

It won't get any better with mileage. You will just get used to it, maybe?

I went 10's of thousands of miles running Pirellis, no head shake. Slapped a set of Avon's on and head shake. 2 more sets of Avon's 3DXm's and same thing, head shake. Installed a new set of Dunlops, head shake gone!

I am fully expecting the new Avon Spirits to do the same. I bought them because they were cheap and 50 dollar rebate.

The 3DXM's were the only tire that got me 6K in miles before worn out. The C14 eats front tires.

Steve · « **Reply #12 on:** February 24, 2019, 10:54:01 pm »

https://youtu.be/QexwzZkEbjA

I tried to make a video with cheap hand camera this evening of it shaking.
Posted it on YouTube

gpd323 · « **Reply #13 on:** February 24, 2019, 11:13:18 pm »

Yup! Thats what mine did at about 50 mph and decelerating. Sir, its the tire! Not anything else on your bike. You installed a new front and bingo head shake.

Either live with it for the duration, or get a new front of a different brand.

MAN OF BLUES · « **Reply #14 on:** February 24, 2019, 11:25:14 pm »

Quote from: Steve on February 24, 2019, 10:54:01 pm

I tried to make a video with cheap hand camera this evening of it shaking.
Posted it on YouTube

$:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$ $:-\$

Steve, please don't place your life at risk, or that of your bike...video recording while riding..
we all know what head shake/tire wobble is..and we believe you... no video proof is necessary...

One thing I never asked was, did you verify what the tire rotation was correct with regard to the tire markings, and by the people that mounted the tire? and have you contacted them, and made arrangements to have them re verify the tire is correctly mounted, and even asked them to pop the beads, and rotate the tire, and re-seat beads/ mount, and re balance it to see if this can be rectified?
I would suggest that. immediately.

gpd323 · « **Reply #15 on:** February 25, 2019, 03:13:05 pm »

A buddy of mine has a 2013 ZX14R and chews through tires especially the rear and many times during our trips he has had to buy a new rear to get home. When I first tried the 3DXM's he was so amazed at the tire life so he purchased a set for his ZX14R. Immediately he got a massive head-shake that was way more pronounced than I had experienced. It was so bad he took the tire off the front and mounted a Pirelli Diablo SS. Head shake was gone. He now runs a Spirit on the rear and the super sports on his Blackbird and ZX14R. This combo gets him the to the end of our trips but both tires on his bike are shot after a 3500-4000 mile trip.

Just some food for thought.

Daboo · « **Reply #16 on:** February 25, 2019, 05:10:04 pm »

Just a thought. Check the tire from the side for being round.

I had tires changed on a bike and it seemed fine at 30 mph. Once I got above that to freeway speeds, the vibration in the front was really bad. I turned around and went back. The mechanics checked for balance. No problems. They checked it for lateral correctness. No problem. There was about 4 guys standing around scratching their heads when someone who had been back from the group a bit said to hold a pencil on the forks that touches the tire tread, and then slowly turn the wheel. There was a huge difference in the tire "roundness".

Chris

MAN OF BLUES · « **Reply #17 on:** February 25, 2019, 07:22:23 pm »

Quote from: Daboo on February 25, 2019, 05:10:04 pm

Just a thought. Check the tire from the side for being round.

I had tires changed on a bike and it seemed fine at 30 mph. Once I got above that to freeway speeds, the vibration in the front was really bad. I turned around and went back. The mechanics checked for balance. No problems. They checked it for lateral correctness. No problem. There was about 4 guys standing around scratching their heads when someone who had been back from the group a bit said to hold a pencil on the forks that touches the tire tread, and then slowly turn the wheel. There was a huge difference in the tire "roundness".

Chris

that is pretty much what I tried to explain in post #4 above....

Just Cliff · « **Reply #18 on:** February 26, 2019, 12:23:46 pm »

Quote from: gpd323 on February 23, 2019, 08:47:10 pm

Thats what I get when I ran the AVON 3DXM's, all 3 sets had a terrible head shake. All the tires before I used never an issue specifically the Pirellis.. I installed some new Dunlops RS3's and no head shake at all.

I know of three different instances where people have had head with other brands. I'm not defending Avon, but the cases I'm referring to were with Angels, RS & Shinko.

So is the C14 just sensitive to less than perfect tires and or is quality control on tires going down hill?

Vote Cliff OTP traveler

Vote Cliff OTP traveler

gpd323 · « **Reply #19 on:** February 26, 2019, 01:54:16 pm »

I had had so many tires on my ZX14 I cannot count. I never experienced any head-shake on that bike, but I never ran an Avon on it either. Cliff, it may be a combination of the two?

I'll let you know what happens when I install the newest set of the Avon Spirits, but that won't be until August or so.

MAN OF BLUES · « **Reply #20 on:** February 26, 2019, 10:48:16 pm »

Quote from: BadgerApaches on February 26, 2019, 05:06:59 pm

Quote from: BadgerApaches on February 24, 2019, 07:04:16 am
Quote from: Steve on February 23, 2019, 10:39:14 pm
My brakes drag so bad this is hard to do. I would have to crack the bleeders probably. Then probaby 2 hours trying to get air out. I have a couple of speed bleeders for a Roadstar. I might see if they will work on this one.
Right now im going to see if i can get another tire. Its been raining about all Feb here. Tonight we are under tornado watch. May not even have to worry about it after tonight.

Err, bleed some fresh fluid into the calipers AFTER you pull the pads out and clean up the caliper bodies and their pistons. Grab some Brembo DOT 4 fluid from AutoZone. DO it.

The pistons HAVE to be extended out after removing the pads, clean off with brake fluid and an old tooth brush, carefully cleaning around the rubber protector boots.

With the front wheel off and the calipers hanging by bungee/wore coat hanger/whatever, an oil drain pan under the front end makes this an easy clean up. The whole process is a PITA, but it is worth it.

this is probably the WORST (sorry in advance) bit of advice I have seen, regarding brakes.
Not the cleaning thing, but suggesting he use Brake fluid...
Brake fluid should never be used anywhere external of the brake system, for any reason; it will suck up moisture, and corrode any metal, and degrade seals, staying trapped behind them when "exposed" to the environment....
Use the proper cleaning product for the job, aerosol BrakeKleen or equivalent.. and even then, wipe everything dry, and blow out any residue and repeat.

I'm sorry if that comes off a "harsh", but I am very adamant about brake fluids propensity for ruining pistons when exposed to air.

gpd323 · « **Reply #21 on:** February 27, 2019, 12:23:26 am »

Besides, getting brake fluid on any painted/coated surface will destroy the paint/finish. Personally, BF belongs in a closed brake system, not outside used as a cleaner.

gpd323 · « **Reply #22 on:** February 27, 2019, 07:05:49 pm »

Oh, OK.

I just never thought to use BF as a cleaner.

I hope to OP gets his head shake figured out.

connie_rider · « **Reply #23 on:** February 27, 2019, 09:22:49 pm »

I had the 3DXM's on my 14. At first they were fine, but the headshake developed later.
This happened on my bike and a friends bikes.
He toughed it out until he replaced the tires...
I contacted Avon thru my supplier {as Avon has a warranty}.
They had me send in both tires for evaluation.
Sometime later they approved replacement tires. {but would not tell me about my tires}
I selected Spirits instead of the 3DXM's and they sent the new tires {plus a few $$ as the Sprits are less expensive}..

Recently installed them and all is fine at this stage. Just took them to Jennings for the track day.

NOTE: I installed a set of Shinko Verge 2X 's while waiting for the new Avon's.
The Shinko's wore out FAST (1300 rear / 1800 front), but were "very" good in the twisties, and had no headshake whatsoever...

Ride safe, Ted

gpd323 · « **Reply #24 on:** February 27, 2019, 10:38:43 pm »

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

thanks!