Author Topic: How much tire do YOU use?  (Read 5799 times)

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Offline Hazy

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #25 on: August 01, 2013, 12:09:22 pm »
I think I do all this stuff automatically because I lean with no issue and I haven't run off the road. yet.

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Offline kd50

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #26 on: August 01, 2013, 11:25:19 pm »
Riding to work pointing my chin everywhere this am I noticed it truly drives you through. Even on a long sweeper I noticed pointing my chin through the corner drove me through with laser precision, no wandering at all. Going to make it a habit.
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Offline shezonit

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #27 on: August 02, 2013, 02:16:26 am »
+1 on the chin point. It is uncanny. In the MSF Experienced Rider course I took ( when I wasn't very experienced, but I did know how to work a clutch...)  they kept repeating "LOOK where you want to GO" and by gosh, that is absolutely true.   Once I started to practice this, I began to trust the bikes ability to get around anything I had the nerve to look through. Decreasing radius curves require more focus, is all. KEEP LOOKING past the curve, not at the curve. AND, smoooooth...... 

I once got myself between 2 big trucks on a tight curve in Mexico (I mean passing one and one oncoming).  Two things happened: first, instead of my life passing before my eyes, I had the distinct thought "Well, I've had a GREAT time!"  second, my rider instinct kicked in and I looked down at the double yellow lines, kept the bike right on them and --- survived. I felt the oncoming truck pass by my left hand.... but I looked ONLY at the lines and kept the power on.  So, yes, look where you want to go.

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Offline S Smith

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #28 on: August 02, 2013, 09:00:40 am »
This "look" technique is not unique to motorcycling, but it is a very important to learn and use all the time.  Keeping the eyes level with the horizon is also important, for reasons stated earlier. 

The whole idea of pointing the chin (which is effectively looking where you want to go) is implementing what is "visual directional control"... or simply stated "where you look is where you will go."  In my experience working with riders it does not automatically create input pressure on the handlebars. The rider must actively do this, but the "look" does make it happen more natural. I've had many new riders who finally began using the "look" step, but still not applying enough pressure for some turns. It did come with practice.  Also in my experience with teaching ARC, forward lean does not automatically apply pressure to the handlebar. Even with this technique the rider must actively "press."
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Offline Hazy

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #29 on: August 02, 2013, 01:12:57 pm »
we use the 'look where you want to go' technique in ice hockey. having played for over 20 years, it felt natural to do it on the bike.
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Offline shezonit

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #30 on: August 02, 2013, 01:36:18 pm »
Another technique someone told me a couple years ago - to lean my chest over the bar in the direction I want to go. This gets my weight forward and puts pressure on the bar. After practicing this it is fairly automatic. In a long stretch of twisties it is a dance I do with my moto.  And isn't that what we do, become one with the bike?   When I get in the zone, it just happens.
But we were talking about tires, yes?
Back when I first had my ST1100, I was steering with the bars, leaning the bike, but not my upper body, until someone told me to lean my body more, allowing the bike to remain more upright, keeping a larger (safer)  contact patch on the ground.
When riding some of the forest roads in Montana, this is better, as there is often loose pea gravel, leaves, pine needles, deer poop, etc. on the curves. More tire on the road=more traction.

Bikes since 2004: '82 GL500,'83 GL650, '86 VFR700, '96 ST1100, '08 KLR650, '05 V-Strom 650, '82 GL1100. '84 GL1200, '10 KLX250, 08 Concours 14.
Just a few more miles,eh?

Offline S Smith

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #31 on: August 02, 2013, 01:50:58 pm »
Another technique someone told me a couple years ago - to lean my chest over the bar in the direction I want to go. This gets my weight forward and puts pressure on the bar. After practicing this it is fairly automatic. In a long stretch of twisties it is a dance I do with my moto.  And isn't that what we do, become one with the bike?   When I get in the zone, it just happens.
But we were talking about tires, yes?
Back when I first had my ST1100, I was steering with the bars, leaning the bike, but not my upper body, until someone told me to lean my body more, allowing the bike to remain more upright, keeping a larger (safer)  contact patch on the ground.
When riding some of the forest roads in Montana, this is better, as there is often loose pea gravel, leaves, pine needles, deer poop, etc. on the curves. More tire on the road=more traction.

We're talking about lean angle when asking how much tire is used....

Rider input on the bars causes lean... lean causes turning.   Look at the way racers hang off.  In general, no part of their body except the hand touches the handlebars.  Forward/side body position affects center of gravity (cog), and when done properly reduces lean angle.   Typical street riding does not "require" this type of body positioning. Spirited/sport riding will benefit from upper body weight shift (as taught in MSF ARC).

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Offline shezonit

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #32 on: August 02, 2013, 02:01:42 pm »
Steve, is ARC beyond ERC?   If so , I will look for a class here in Montana. Or better yet,  in Arizona this winter when I have more time.
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #33 on: August 02, 2013, 04:09:04 pm »
Getting myself back on tires,,,
As we stated earlier, (when pushed)  the belted Tires go all the way to/past the edge.
My assumption is for 80- 90% of the riders, this is ok as most don't push enough to go past the edge and get loose.
The other 10-20% should be on radials!

With me riding the twisties, the 16" radials seem to leave a little bit of Chicken material.
The 17 (that I rode),,,, went all the way to the edge.
I assume all of this (including belted) is because of the different tire profiles??

Most of us use approx. 40 PSI in our rear tires. (for weight/handling/longevity)
On the track (C-10) bikes, I'm pretty certain that they reduce tire pressure so that the tire gives more contact area in a turn?
Can someone that has had a track course reply?

Lastly, is there a Discussion scheduled at the National on Twisty riding?

Ride safe, Ted

PSL On "the Chin" pointing the chin is intended to move your upper weight forwards, and "inboard".
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Offline smithr1

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #34 on: August 02, 2013, 04:29:45 pm »
Three pages of how much tire do you use?  I use all mine.  The times part of my tire was missing were all bad days.
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Offline S Smith

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #35 on: August 02, 2013, 06:51:06 pm »
Steve, is ARC beyond ERC?   If so , I will look for a class here in Montana. Or better yet,  in Arizona this winter when I have more time.


Yes it is.  Here is s list of current MSF offierings.  Course names can be different within each state program.  You may see it listed as ARC or ARC-ST.   Note: this is different than the Lee Parks Total Control ARC. 


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Offline Slingblade

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #36 on: August 02, 2013, 11:35:10 pm »
I figure I paid for 190mm's so I should use all of em.... :great:
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Offline wile_e_coyote

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #37 on: August 02, 2013, 11:40:50 pm »
I figure I paid for 190mm's so I should use all of em.... :great:

Nice :beerchug:

Offline kd50

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #38 on: August 04, 2013, 10:49:03 pm »
I figure I paid for 190mm's so I should use all of em.... :great:

Nice :beerchug:
+1 
I am learning the bike has more abillity than I have nerves. All the tips and tricks in here are great. There is a ton of bike knowledge to be had in here but rider/riding technique is as important imo.
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Offline ron203

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #39 on: August 05, 2013, 12:37:46 am »
Riding to work pointing my chin everywhere this am I noticed it truly drives you through. Even on a long sweeper I noticed pointing my chin through the corner drove me through with laser precision, no wandering at all. Going to make it a habit.

+1

Tried that today. Works great.
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Offline wile_e_coyote

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #40 on: August 05, 2013, 05:44:07 pm »
Riding to work pointing my chin everywhere this am I noticed it truly drives you through. Even on a long sweeper I noticed pointing my chin through the corner drove me through with laser precision, no wandering at all. Going to make it a habit.

+1

Tried that today. Works great.

I tried this also worked like a dream.
Was not as scary going in a little hot.
I like it and will keep practicing.

Offline Edward

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #41 on: August 05, 2013, 05:48:21 pm »
Tried this myself over the weekend and noticed that I am not looking nearly as far into the curve as I could/should be. Definitely helped keep the line cleaner.


Will keep practicing, thanks for the great tip.

FWIW, I am an in-line hockey coach and we also use the idea of "turn your head and look where you want to go" to teach maneuverability on the floor.






Offline Hazy

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #42 on: August 05, 2013, 06:06:39 pm »
Tried this myself over the weekend and noticed that I am not looking nearly as far into the curve as I could/should be. Definitely helped keep the line cleaner.


Will keep practicing, thanks for the great tip.

FWIW, I am an in-line hockey coach and we also use the idea of "turn your head and look where you want to go" to teach maneuverability on the floor.

Yep, same on the ice. I play ice because I like to stop.  :-\
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Offline LakeTrax

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #43 on: August 05, 2013, 08:08:21 pm »
Just got back from riding some of the best/curviest roads eastern KY has to offer...
My '12 is still shy of 3,000 miles and the stock "stones" are nearly toast- Junk tires to begin with, but I was too cheap to bin 'em immediately. Really looking forward to some new Michelin honey buns! >:D

Offline Mcfly

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #44 on: August 05, 2013, 09:14:25 pm »
Lots of good reading here.  In my second year back on 2 wheels, I use the part of the tire
that contacts the pavement most.  Really could care less about chicken strips, or scraping pegs...

Down here on the Space Coast, there's not much turning  :'(  I have put most of my effort
in entering the turn at the desired speed, rolling on before the turn, and looking where I want to go.
The rest takes care of itself... I make it through the turn upright, in my lane... WIN!

I have been going into turns with a wee bit more speed as my skills improve, but no desire
to use ALL the tire, just to get through the turn properly.  I don't even pay attention to my
lean...  I must be leaning just the right amount, because I'm exactly where I want to be
consistently.  I do check one thing on my tires quite often.... tire pressure.

I guess I'm far from a throttle jockey, but I'm still grinnin' so I really don't care...
Someday I may want to push the limits a bit more, then I'll be at the track, not
on the roads.  Cagers be craaazy...
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Offline kd50

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #45 on: August 06, 2013, 12:33:06 am »
Just got back from riding some of the best/curviest roads eastern KY has to offer...
My '12 is still shy of 3,000 miles and the stock "stones" are nearly toast- Junk tires to begin with, but I was too cheap to bin 'em immediately. Really looking forward to some new Michelin honey buns! >:D
Can't use any more than that. That must be a nice rush ducking into the corner that far.
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Offline kd50

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #46 on: August 10, 2013, 11:35:49 pm »
So Here is my pic. Not as impressive as some.
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #47 on: August 11, 2013, 09:50:23 pm »
KD, is that a powder coated differential?
Rim powder coated?

You have a picture of the whole bike?

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Offline Slingblade

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #48 on: August 13, 2013, 06:59:00 pm »
I figure I paid for 190mm's so I should use all of em.... :great:


Nice :beerchug:

+1 
I am learning the bike has more abillity than I have nerves. All the tips and tricks in here are great. There is a ton of bike knowledge to be had in here but rider/riding technique is as important imo.


The basic stuff IMHO:
    *Look through the turn - plot your line and hit it
    *Make sure you can see all the way through the turn before you decide to hit it hard
    *Dont go IN to the turn too hot, a controlled entry point is critical- power THROUGH-it. 
    *If you have to tap the brakes inside the turn - you screwed it up
    *Downshift going in - you dont want to be in too high of a gear inside the turn..its better to have to wind-it-up than to bog it down
    *PUSH left to go left, PUSH right to go right...in really tight turns I focus on pushing the bike DOWN while accelerating = countersteering basics
    *DON'T try to keep-up with others - ride your own ride...this is supposed to fun and relaxing !

Where you live plays a role too - I happen to live around a lot of mountain roads with tight hairpin turns and and plenty of off-camber turns that cause you to scrape you pegs more often.   

BTW - this http://www.msgroup.org/articles.aspx  is the best website I have found on interwebs for basic riding smarts - lots of great stuff there.  I have to admit - there are quite a few parts that are just over my head.

« Last Edit: August 13, 2013, 07:08:17 pm by Slingblade »
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Offline Edward

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Re: How much tire do YOU use?
« Reply #49 on: August 13, 2013, 08:06:47 pm »
[size=78%]*DON'T try to keep-up with others - ride your own ride...this is supposed to fun and relaxing ![/size]


+1


Power through the turns, relax on the straights, that way my cruiser buddies can catch up. :motonoises:


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