Author Topic: ZRX Front End Replacement  (Read 16473 times)

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Offline Bob_C_CT

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #50 on: May 14, 2012, 06:25:48 pm »
Thanks Sport Rider in advance. I bet you're going to love the setup. I read you are having trouble with the caliper sticking in the ZG1000 General Chat and Tech. I was lucky that mine were clean to begin with and worked out ok. Bleeding was pretty simple as the calipers had the lines still attached. I attached lines to master cylinder, removed most of the one year old fluid from master with big eye dropper. Filled master with fresh fluid and pumped limp lever 200+ times while tapping lines. Most lever pumps netted a small bubble from bottom of resevoir, by the end of pumping limp handle I had to fill halfway depleted resevoir twice then got some decent resitance at lever and the little geyser going on from the bottom of reservoir. Then bled each caliper about 5 or so times to get rid of rest of the bubbles and had a firm lever. If you are starting with clean/dry lines I've heard it said that you should pour some fluid through them before assy, it helps in getting the fluid started after you attach them to the master, some sorta capillary thing going on when the lines are already wet. Good luck and I hope you are on the road shortly.
Southern Connecticut.
97 C10,ZRX Front, Meanstreak rim

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #51 on: May 14, 2012, 07:15:04 pm »
yeah.  my biggest question was with dry calipers.  I've replaced with dry lines before, but got to thinking about the calipers as I was putting them back together, so just looking for any tips or tricks for doing those.  I'll be tinkering with them tonight, so we'll see.   :motonoises:

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #52 on: May 16, 2012, 11:45:49 pm »
not great, but here's a picture of the ignition switch cut away.  Still only rough cut, but hopefully will give you an idea.  The reason for cutting is to have clearance around the cap on the top of the neck.

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #53 on: May 16, 2012, 11:48:34 pm »
cable routing.  I need to fix the routing of the brake line on the far side.  Note that the clutch line had clearance to turn back down to it's original position.  Risers are near the top of the list too as long as the cables and wires will reach.  I think they will.

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #54 on: May 16, 2012, 11:51:55 pm »
A couple pictures of the wheel installed.  note the brake calipers aren't attached.  more work coming on those.  Also the fender is chopped on the front and does not extend as far as OEM.  PO did that.  I'm kinda liking the black rim and fender though, contrasting the the color of the bike and matching the lower black section of the body work.  I'm thinking about blacking out the rear to match.

Offline GF-in-CA

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #55 on: May 17, 2012, 01:58:58 am »
I'm thinking about blacking out the rear to match.

Or get a black Mean Streak wheel   >:D

Looking great!   :13:
Gary F.

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Offline Bob_C_CT

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #56 on: May 17, 2012, 09:33:52 am »
Looks good sport rider. The black looks good with the gold. Thanks for the pics of the ignition. You have to get those brakes straightened out so you get some ride time soon you must be chomping at the bit. Good luck and let us know how you make out with the caliper reseal. By the way the risers work ok with stock cables the only thing is the rubbing of the throttle cables between bottom of ign switch and fairing mount at steering neck
Southern Connecticut.
97 C10,ZRX Front, Meanstreak rim

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #57 on: May 17, 2012, 10:57:51 am »
I'm thinking about blacking out the rear to match.

Or get a black Mean Streak wheel   >:D

Looking great!   :13:

Already got Gary.   :beerchug:

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #58 on: May 17, 2012, 11:02:44 am »
Looks good sport rider. The black looks good with the gold. Thanks for the pics of the ignition. You have to get those brakes straightened out so you get some ride time soon you must be chomping at the bit. Good luck and let us know how you make out with the caliper reseal. By the way the risers work ok with stock cables the only thing is the rubbing of the throttle cables between bottom of ign switch and fairing mount at steering neck

the chomping isn't going too bad.  other than being anxious to try out the new front end, I've got my superhawk for my daily commute, so still get my 2-wheel fix.   >:D

Offline Bergmen

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #59 on: May 17, 2012, 02:41:43 pm »
I'm kinda liking the black rim and fender though, contrasting the the color of the bike and matching the lower black section of the body work.  I'm thinking about blacking out the rear to match.


Yeah, the front end looks great. I plan to black out the rear also, all I have to do is the rear drive housing:



Dan
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Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #60 on: May 19, 2012, 02:13:29 am »
New brake pads arrived today.  I got an email notice from Ron Ayers that the new seals are to be delivered on Monday.  It should only take me an evening or two to rebuild the calipers.  then I should be able to test her out!

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #61 on: May 19, 2012, 01:37:52 pm »
So, the project just expanded from a front end replacement to a full suspension replacement.  I scored this ZZR1200 rear shock off ebay last night.  The price was just too good to pass up, and according to the info, it's got ZERO miles on it.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/350566863273?_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649&item=350566863273&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK:MEWNX:IT&vxp=mtr#ht_1150wt_718

Once I get these done, I'll have 17s front and rear with full suspension upgrade.   >:D

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #62 on: May 20, 2012, 09:42:52 pm »
new brake pads.....excellent!  Brakes now work like a charm.  They are releasing just fine, so no rebuild seems to be required.  Bad news.....fork seal leaking.  Argh!!!   >:(

its ridable as is, but I need to replace the tire before I make any real judgements.  Initial thoughts are positive though.

Offline Bob_C_CT

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #63 on: May 21, 2012, 06:22:24 am »
Sorry to hear about fork seals. Please do a write up on the fork rebuild if you can. Went to the NE spring fling on the new ZRX setup.  Ride was good I am getting a little more deacceleration wobble, going to have to tighten stem bearing. It isn't too noticeable until you take one hand off the bars, not a tank slapper but a little uncomfortable. I think I have the adjustments on the forks set pretty good, nose dive on braking greatly improved and rebound on bumps is mellower than on OEM.
Am able to get on centerstand with a liitle more effort than it took with OEM front end, but still have stock rear tire for now. If it gets worse with rear rim change I may chop a section of centerstand off and reweld. Noticed sidestand is leaving bike in a more straight up attitude and I am going to cut off about a 3/8 - 1/2" and reweld from my guestament

Was riding 2 up and now feeling like rear suspension needs a little attention. I saw the zzr shocks for sale on ebay and thinking of doing that when I change out back rim/tire, good price although I don't think it comes with lower hardware. I may look at lowering link if I pull the trigger on that ZZR shock.

Good luck with getting the upgrade finished, it's worth the effort, unless you have the funds for the c14 upgrade, LoL.
Southern Connecticut.
97 C10,ZRX Front, Meanstreak rim

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #64 on: May 21, 2012, 01:10:17 pm »
Rode to work today and I'm continuing to gather data as I'm riding.  After arriving at work, fork seal definitely leaking.  It's not massive leaking, but enough to make the fork tube wet.  Continuing to monitor that. 

Brakes are definitely better and whether someone does a ZRX front end upgrade, or gets a bracket and installs some better calipers, it's worth the time and effort.  I now feel comfortable stopping the motorcycle using only the front brake.  Not that I don't use both, but it's nice to know there's enough braking power out front.

The bike seemed to be smooth over bumps, but my front end was diving a bit.  not as much as stock, but noticeable.  I have not checked sag yet, so I'm going to do that and tweek a bit on settings to see if I can improve it some.

There is still some vibration in the bars, but it seems to be less than stock.  it wasn't bothersome, just noticeable.  I'm going to try to find someone close and do a side-by-side comparison to get a better feel for the change.

The stock ZRX bars and risers are a bit low, but after riding the Superhawk all week and leaning over, the ZRX setup was certainly more upright.  It didn't feel bad at all, but eventually I'll probably add risers.  Bob....did you install the straight risers, or the ones that also had a pull-back?

My front tire is crap, so I'm not able to get a very good feel on ride control and cornering.  It's the tire that came with the setup and I'm using it until I get a fresh one, but it's V'd off pretty bad.  that's making it feel like it's falling or flopping into turns.  Enough that I feel I have to fight the steering to keep from going in too fast.  I'm sure that will improve with better rubber.

I re-routed my front brake line to relieve some tension on the throttle cables.  I was experimenting with the RPM rise and have determined it's when the choke/enricher is on.  When I turn bars to the left, RPMs rise.  Nothing worth worrying about as I hardly keep in on choke long enough to notice anything.  All other cables and routing seems to be working fine.  We'll see how it does with risers, but there appears to be enough play in all lines to be ok.

the ride height of the bike is certainly lower, particularly in the front.  I have not measured how much, but enough that you can tell when sitting on the bike.  Putting it on the center stand is a man's chore, for sure.  When I get the new 170/60 on the back instead of the current 160/70, it will probably be even more so.  The plus is the rear wheel is higher off the ground and that should make rear tire removal a little easier with clearance at the fender.  On the kickstand it's more upright, as Bob said above, but still leans.  For now I just have to be careful about where I park the bike.

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #65 on: May 21, 2012, 03:11:04 pm »
Sorry to hear about fork seals. Please do a write up on the fork rebuild if you can. Went to the NE spring fling on the new ZRX setup.  Ride was good I am getting a little more deacceleration wobble, going to have to tighten stem bearing. ......

Bob...I'm going to watch for this.  what speeds or conditions are you experiencing this?

Offline Bob_C_CT

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #66 on: May 21, 2012, 03:46:37 pm »
Sport Rider, the risers are straight but the blocks on the triple have are angled back so not sure if they are stock. I'll will get pics tonight.
The wobble is at deaccelration only and around the 50 down to 25 mph zone, not very noticeable with 2 hands on bar, take one hand off and bar starts to wobble back and forth about 1/4" each way. My original setup did this at same deaccel speed but worse when I bought it and tightened up stem bearings and it went away. I didn't want to crank down tightly on this install until bearings seated in so I was expecting some looseness after some miles, probably could live with it but why if I 'm pretty certain what the cause and remedy is.
Southern Connecticut.
97 C10,ZRX Front, Meanstreak rim

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #67 on: May 21, 2012, 04:07:00 pm »
I'll give it a try on the way home this evening.

My stock risers are angled back too.  From looking at the fiche, I believe that is stock.  I noticed some risers when poking around the net.  there's a version that is straight and another that has an offset.  I was considering just the straight version because of the angle the riser is already at.

Offline Bergmen

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #68 on: May 21, 2012, 04:46:15 pm »
Sport Rider, the risers are straight but the blocks on the triple have are angled back so not sure if they are stock. I'll will get pics tonight.
The wobble is at deaccelration only and around the 50 down to 25 mph zone, not very noticeable with 2 hands on bar, take one hand off and bar starts to wobble back and forth about 1/4" each way. My original setup did this at same deaccel speed but worse when I bought it and tightened up stem bearings and it went away. I didn't want to crank down tightly on this install until bearings seated in so I was expecting some looseness after some miles, probably could live with it but why if I 'm pretty certain what the cause and remedy is.

Mine did exactly the same thing when I first mounted the forks. I attributed part of this to the fact that the ZRX forks were shorter, steepening the rake a bit. This can make the forks twitchy and in my case, the bearings were loose to the point that it felt like a tank slapper was imminent if I took both hands off the handlebars.

I had other problems that were contributing to this also. First, the forks were cranked all the way down in damping (both compression and rebound) and spring preload. A also had an Avon Storm up front and an ME880 in back. Stiff as a buckboard and oil and water for tires + loose bearings.

I started with tightening the bearings to eliminate all looseness. Major improvement but still not right. Then I discovered the adjustments out of whack and backed all three of them out to the minimum settings. Again, a major improvement. But the tire incompatibility had me questioning the value of the whole ZRX fork replacement exercise. Once I wised up and put an Azaro on the rear, that did it, all was well. I've never looked back.

Dan

(edit to re-write)
« Last Edit: May 22, 2012, 10:25:49 am by Bergmen »
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Offline Bob_C_CT

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #69 on: May 22, 2012, 10:57:19 am »
Thanks Dan for the test method for steering bearing tightness. I got to do it tonight, rain most of this week so good time to go through it.
Sport Rider here are the pics of the stock angled handle bar adapters and straight riser blocks. Now I see why my allergies are acting up, I see pollen.
Southern Connecticut.
97 C10,ZRX Front, Meanstreak rim

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #70 on: May 22, 2012, 02:11:33 pm »
If it's any help Bob, mine has dust all over it too.   :))

My risers are angled just like yours.  those are the stock ZRX versions.  I was thinking about the straight inserts just like you used.  There's another style that has an offset, but I was thinking that would be too much for me.

I paid some attention to the wobbles last night.  I had a very slight wobble between 45 and 40.  Less than I've experienced with my stock setup in the past.  No other wobbling down to slow speeds.  If I remember correctly, I loosened up and re-torqued the various pieces around the axle and it improved things a lot.  When I replaced my tire, it helped greatly too.  If your head is not tight, I'm sure that could be a factor too.  The experienced guys around here have covered that stuff really well, so I'm sure just some trial and error will solve it for you.

And Dan.....thanks for the reminder of the easy check for the steering head.  I checked mine last night too.  I'm tight.  :)

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #71 on: May 23, 2012, 02:16:18 pm »
Last night on the way home from work I stopped by Tom's house so we could compare his stock 06 against my modified 05.  When sitting on the bike, at the chin fairing, his measured 4 3/4 and mine was 4 1/4, so obviously 1/2 inch of height lost at that point.  I'm running a 160/70-17 rear and he's still got the stock 16, but given the 160 height is very close to his, that should not have had impact to the height difference.

The vibration was the other thing we were both curious about.  At idle and at 5k RPM, there was still vibration in both, but we agreed that the sharpness or magnitude of the vibrations was significantly reduced with the rubber mounting.  Basically we felt it was a smoother vibration.  That's pretty much how I've been feeling while riding it the past few days, but it was nice to have a side-by-side comparison.

I know Steve (SISF) has been working on his upper triple modification for rubber mounting, and it sounded similar in setup to how the ZRX bolts up.  If his results are as good as the ZRX upgrade (and I'm betting it'll be better, knowing steve  ;)  ), people should be really pleased with the results.  I know I'm loving the new ZRX setup!

The only negative I have at this time is the slow-speed steering and the feeling that the bike wants to drop into a turn too aggressively.  It's to the point that I feel I have to fight against it.  However, I KNOW my front tire is not good, so I'm holding off on that until I have a chance to replace it and do a little more height adjustment on the fork tubes in the triple to get as much length out of them as possible.

Offline Bergmen

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #72 on: May 23, 2012, 03:03:22 pm »
I found tire choices to have a profound effect on handling with the ZRX forks. They really are tuned for modern, low profile radials.

Also, I mounted the Concours bar end weights to my Honda Nighthawk handlebars and I have no problem with handlebar vibrations at all. I also use foam grips so that is certainly a component.

I have my fork tubes flush with the top surface of the upper triple clamp to extend the rake as much as possible. This also raises the bike to the max as far as the front forks are concerned.

With fresh tires and proper balancing (make sure they are balanced in both static AND dynamic), I would suspect you will arrive at a no wobble condition being that your bearings are tight as you say. With my first new front tire I had a slight dynamic imbalance that induced a bit of a wobble. It took me awhile to figure it out. Once I divided the balance weights evenly on each side of the rim, it went completely away. Since this occured, I have had the balance guys evenly divide the weights on either side of the rim when balancing the new wheel/tire.

Dynamic imbalance potential is heightened on these wheels since they are wider than the stock Concours wheels, allowing the balancing weights to be positioned further away from the axial center of mass.

Once you get this all dialed-in, you are really going to be pleased with the razor sharp handling, sure-footedness and tremendous braking that this front end provides. And it all works so well in concert with the rigid Concours chassis, there are no downsides to this conversion.

Dan
--2014 Yamaha FJR1300A--
--ZGRX 1200 Concours (sold)--
--SPOOFAK Inventor--

Offline Dave Scott

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #73 on: May 23, 2012, 03:14:12 pm »
just for reference, the tire that is on it now is a Bridgestone Battleax BT014.  Problem is it's been rode hard and the profile is worn out on it.  It's ok for testing things out as there is still tread and no age cracking or anything, but I know it's having an affect on handling.  I just haven't quite decided on what tires to get for it, and also waiting for the funds to build back up a little bit.   :'(

Offline Bob_C_CT

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Re: ZRX Front End Replacement
« Reply #74 on: May 23, 2012, 04:24:21 pm »
+1 on what Dan said, put forks even with the top of upper triple. I do find it has faster drop in for turns, yaaa, but I don't have to fight it from dropping when going straight.

Didn't have abundant vibration at the bars in that rpm range on my original setup until I got up to the 7-8k bees nest buzz.
So now I still have the same buzz bit it is muffled like you stated because of the rubber isolaters in the handle bar mounts.
I don't notice the mush of the rubber isolaters on the road but pushing the bike around the garage and driveway by the bar ends you definitely feel a little mush there.

The steering stem was loose by testing per Dan's instructions so I went to tighten it without removing tank. I was easily able to get an eighth of a revolution out of it until the wrench hit the bar adapter. Then went to move spanner to next notch but damn I put on the washer that has 2 bent tabs 180 degrees from each other that fit into two out of the four notches on the nut. Not really sure that washer with tabs is necessary. I couldn't get a good bite on any other ones unless I remove tank. Tank is full. I will try a test ride as soon as the rains stops to see if I moved it enough and burn up some fuel.

I still have stock rim on back until I eat up the 1k miles or so it has left to indicators. To put it on centerstand at this point is a little tougher than stock but still possible. I think I am going with the taller 17" for the first go round because of height and lesser RPMs. If I get around to a 7th gear unit and zzr shock that may change to the smaller diameter. Using Avon Storm.
Southern Connecticut.
97 C10,ZRX Front, Meanstreak rim