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R1150RT vs C10 - my initial impression

alexg

Bicycle
Hello my fellow COGgers and lurkers,

the following is my initial impression on how the R1150RT compares to the C10. I had two Connies before, 1999 and later 2005, for a total of seven riding seasons. Few months ago I sold my 2005 C10 and acquired a 2004 R1150RT in very good shape and already clocked about 5K miles on it. Keep in mind that I am a sport-TOURING, not a SPORT-touring, rider and rarely ride with a pillion.

First most noticeable thing about RT is that it does not salsa in dirty air behind trucks, buses or any other large-and-not-very-aerodynamic moving objects. It rides absolutely straight and feels nailed to the road. This is a total departure from yanking and dancing Connie in similar conditions. While riding Connie, I had always reflexively searched for a lane without a truck/bus/van in front of me to minimize “the dance”. I don’t notice the dirty air or crosswinds as much on RT; the bike just slices through whirls as a knife through butter. I guess BMW R&D guys took good notes while testing the RT in a wind tunnel.

Gears on the RT are different – they are all taller and spread wider. The 6th gear is true overdrive and can not be effectively used at town speeds because it’s too tall. The first five gears will manage 99 per cent of situations and the 6th will shine on the interstate. I may never again search for the “7th gear” as I continuously did with Connie.

I expected a long and unpleasant “acquire-a-taste” period for throbs from the boxer engine but my fears never materialized. It was strange at first, especially at a stand still, to feel how the RT shakes, but I got used to it quickly. Shaking transforms into vibration as the bike starts to move. When I got onto the interstate for the first time I thought that traffic was moving oddly slow only to realize (by checking speedometer) that I am moving well above posted limits. The point is you don’t feel speed on the RT as much as on Connie based only on sensation from engine. When Connie “buzzes” at high rpm the RT just vibrates. This vibration is present at all rpms but does not bother you or, worse, put your hands to sleep. After a while I stopped even noticing this vibration. Having quieter engine and being more aerodynamic, the RT is much quieter bike overall compared to roaring Connie.

Riding the RT at highway speeds brings me to a feature I’ve always wanted on a touring bike – the power adjustable, push-of-the-button windshield. Switching from non-adjustable shield(s) on Connie to infinitely adjustable one on RT makes you realize how intelligent, civilized and practical this feature is. I’ve started using it after only minutes with this bike. Lower down in town, up on the highway, and somewhere in between if it’s hot. I believe this must be a built-in feature on every touring bike. This particular RT has an aftermarket CB euro-style shield which is slightly different in shape, a bit taller and wider than stock and is perfect for my 6’ stature. The stock shield would also be adequate as I have found out testing another RT.

The fairing on the RT is almost as protective as the one on Connie. If it is really-really cold, like below freezing cold, my thumbs are getting frosty even with grip’s heat on high. I suspect an upward flow of air from the bottom of mirror assembly directed just a bit too high and therefore reaching the area below handlebars. This could probably be fixed by installing small deflective wings below mirrors. The side panels are not as wide as those on Connie and my knee are also getting cold faster. Conversely, even reversed scoops on Connie didn’t help keeping my feet as warm as on the RT. Again, you may notice these small imperfections only during very cold weather.

The RT is, of course, no match to muscular Connie in power department but, as I have mentioned before, racing is not my forte and unhurried power delivery is fine for my riding style. Dropping to lower gear makes blending with traffic effortless when entering highways. And even though the RT is not based on a sport bike it flicks in and out of corners almost by itself and feels very secure and planted doing it. For me, a scenic, long and untiring (meaning: my hands are not asleep; my legs are not cramped; my head is not blasted with buffeting; I am stopping only because there is a great scenery to be photographed, not because of fatigue; I am ready for a party after 6 hours of riding; etc.) ride through Catskill or Adirondack Parks is by far more attractive, desirable and enjoyable than a race to outrun everyone on the road or pegs scratching while taking a corner at hair-raising velocity.

Suspension on the RT is plusher so road bumps and potholes of Manhattan are handled gracefully compared to bumpy and rattling Connie which was ready to loose all its parts going up Madison Avenue. Riding the RT along the same avenue felt like riding on smooth surface.

Next, let me tell you about the stopping power of the RT. The first time I had to use the brakes in an emergency (traffic light changing from green to red skipping yellow on an intersection monitored by advertised Red Light Camera!) I thought the bike would stand on its front wheel - that’s how powerful and effortless the brakes are even when only two fingers are operating the brake lever. But all went well - the bike just stopped on the dime. No fuss, no thrills, just extremely efficient, controlled and very short stopping! Both wheels were in contact with asphalt at all times, no wheel locking, no skids, and no slides. That was simply spectacular! Even drivers around me have noticed this grand act!  I was so amazed that I later had to google the net to find out how this EVO-servo-ABS-whatever stuff works exactly. The point is it does work and works brilliantly! In the same situation Connie had tried to lock rear wheel and skidded and slide all over for a much longer stopping distance. You could start blaming rider, of course, but I now strongly believe that in an emergency the RT will out brake Connie hands… err, tires down!

The riding position on the RT is more up-right and relaxed. There is no pressure on the wrists/arms/shoulders, no discomfort in the legs, and everything feels more natural. This RT came with additional luxurious custom front seat (Russell’s Day-Long?), but, surprisingly, my tush likes the plain stock seat much better. Front seat can be adjusted over 3 height positions and as it goes up it also slides back giving taller rider more leg room. I’ve tried almost all available seats for Connie but stock seat on RT is more comfortable than all of them.

Putting the RT on its center stand is a breeze. Yes, I did master the technique of raising Titanic... err…  Connie on its center stand, but it was always a very carefully coordinated effort, not a natural and easy move as with RT.

Side bags on RT can be equipped with 3 different (size) lids and this one has extra large installed, so I can easily store large full face helmet, summer jacket and more in each, meaning they are much larger than Connie’s. This RT also has an original BMW top box which was specifically made for this model and blends very nicely with bike’s lines. However, fitting a large full face helmet into it requires some creativity because of its odd shape. Closing, opening, removing and installing any bag is a two seconds affair. There is also one lockable storage bin up front and it's larger than both of Connie's combined. Ignition key opens all locks.

As far as negative points - I can’t find any at this time. 

I do understand that service and parts for the RT cost more, but that is something I’ve decided to accept. I do not work on my bikes myself because of lack of time and place and, since there is no Kawasaki (or any reputable for that matter) dealer in or near New York City, the service of C10 was always a major headache. Previously, I had to pay for a motorcycle towing service or beg/bribe/blackmail one of my friends to take an unplanned vacation so that he can drive me from and to dependable Kawasaki dealer half a state away. So, where were my savings? Now I can drop the RT at BMW of Manhattan (no affiliation, etc.), be back home 10 minutes later, know that my bike will be taken care of with guaranties and allow my friends to live their own life because I can pick the bike up by myself and at any time I feel like it.

Furthermore, there were few things that have always bothered me about Connie: overall roughness; unavoidable need to customize; fixed windshield; and, although very controlled on both of my C10s, but a "buzz" nonetheless. The RT, on the other hand, is very comfortable in stock form, better designed and equipped and, consequently, more enjoyable and safe to ride. Did I mention the fact that RT is VERY comfortable? 

Let me just add that a late model RT with low mileage and in very good shape could be found for $5-6K in today's market. And there is an almost infinite choice of 17" tires available for this bike.


Again, these notes are just my .02 kopeks on how the R1150RT compares to the C10, so your experience may be shockingly different.  :eek:

Here are links to two galleries with images of Connie(s) and the RT:
http://www.gofayzen.com/FrontPageC.html
http://www.gofayzen.com/R1150RTWeb.html

Ride safe no matter what you ride and enjoy!

Happy New Year and best wishes!!!  :)
Alex.
 
Great write up Alex. And congrats on the new to you bike. It did look really nice. I can't wait for our next ride to see how she goes!
 
Alex:

Congratulations on your new ride and also on a fine comparison.  Now I can say that as I have both a beemer and a C10. 

You are right, the connie does not ride as well as a beemer.  I've ridden the RT, GT, and have a LT.  The connie does not have a electrically move-able windshield, cruise control, heated seats, radio, and a lot of other farkles, but the connie can be fixed relatively easy, even on the road.  Many times that is not the case for the beemers.  They have some issues that often mean you get it home in a trailer or else someone comes out and picks it up. 

I'm not up to date on all the items you should look for, but one is "rear drive failure".  BMW says the number of RDF's is only 4% of all the models made, but if you will check on several of the BMW boards you will see that the percentage is a lot higher, estimated to be above 15%.  So I'd suggest you do a check of some RT specific boards or lists and get up to date on what you can expect. 

Now while my LT's ride and handling is much better than the C10, every time I get ready to leave on a long trip I have to take a reality check, that it could be coming back home in the back of a pickup.  Yes, I've had a rear drive failure and I have one more issue to improve the reliability of or suffer a clutch failure on short notice, all due to a seal failing.

The main thing is there is no perfect MC, each and every model has its own quirks, issues, and problems. 

tcars
John
 
All:
I must be getting older - I'm starting to look at the BMW!  Love his RT. The maintenance is one of my concerns. But, I just saw one over at BMW Atlanta that got my attention.

I still like my '99 Connie, and ride for the touring, with a little sport once in a while. :) 

Nice to hear that someone is moving on with a great bike and like he said, just ride your ride and be safe!

Phil
'99 Connie 'lectric
COG#5879
 
I have a '99 C-10. It is farkled up to fit me, for sport Touring. The only states/provinces not ridden by me on the Connie are TX, NM, CA, OR, NWT, NFL. it has over 140,000 miles on it. Compression as of yesterday is 175 to 180 lbs(thanx SiSF). This bike is comfy for me, for major long distance days, my highest being slightly over 1300 miles. What ever floats your boat.

I've also owned, and toured on a '72 GT750, '76 Wing, '76 R90/6, '72 CB750, '79 XS750. All that being said, the Beemer is the only bike I had to haul home in a pick up, 600 miles from home. It's also the only bike I've had to had a transmission rebuilt on, not the same occasion, though it would have also ended a trip if I was traveling at the time.

So, enjoy your Beemer, lotsa folks do. Just too many potentially trip ending and/or very expensive breakdowns for me to deal with.

I would really like some ABS, though.

Edit to add: I forgot about a '98 KLR650 I road out to CA last spring, no pick up necessary.

Edit to add some more:
$$ aside, value of traveling through say, eastern Montana and not worrying about a catastrophic, trip ending breakdown 100's of miles from a dealer: priceless. I could never put my mind at ease traveling on a Beemer. YMMV.
 
  Just to put a point on the superiority of the bmw's over the kawasaki's... yesterday SteveJ and I did a compression  test on his 140,000 mile 99 concours. 175 to 180#. Just like when new. Yeah, the beeners do have better fit and finish of the body parts, but the  seemingly rudimentary engineering you get on a c-10 is rock-solid and bulletproof. Steve
 
Nice write up. Glad your happy with your BMW.  I think it a bit unfair though to compare the two engine's vibrations.  ANY in-line 4 is going to have a very different "feel" to it compared to a 2 cylinder opposed engine.  Prices are also something to consider. I'm pretty confident that you paid significantly more for your Beemer than for your C10s (possibly even combined  :)). None the less, enjoy the ride and have a Happy New Year. 
 
All:
I think my '99 still has at least 170-180 compression! :) When I twist the throttle and see the little white needle go past 5K on the RPMs I have to really hold on and everything gets blurry! It comes alive at 5!  And mine only has 64K on the trip meter!

Someone I once knew in another life said BMWs were at another level! The C10 for me, in this life, is fine. But I could go for a C14 or ST1300 :)

CFO has other ideas.

Phil
COG#5879
99 'lectric
 
Alex, you shure sound like a Beemer guy now.  :-* Good luck with that 1150RT. It was 1 of the best skooters I've ever demoed.
 
Good (and fair, I think) write-up/comparison Alex.

I think you have done the best thing for your situation in making this switch.  An important part of the riding experience is maintenance and dependability, and if you don't have the time to do it yourself then you need a dependable service dept nearby to assist.  If one is willing and able to pay for this, then why not?  Myself, I enjoy learning how to do the work, and enjoy the actual work itself as a form of leisure, but I would readily agree that not everyone does or will feel this way.  Certainly, BMW makes great, if expensive, bikes and always the debate will rage on as to pros/cons vs. other manufacturers but I would also suggest that if you are touring and do need help you are probably better off with a BMW shop than a Kaw one.  As far as the dependability of Connie, I have personally experienced three mechanical breakdowns away from home, luckily none that delayed me more than a day, but also none due to a lack of regular or botched maintenance- so dependability can certainly vary with the bike, rider and use regardless of marque.  The vast majority of comments I hear about BMW shop service usually include terms like 'professional', 'high quality', 'dependable' and 'trustworthy'; would that I heard this more (or experienced it) from people about Kawasaki dealer service.

I couldn't help but think, though, in reading this how many of the items you listed as improved over the Connie (C10) have been improved in the C14; still, perhaps as you mentioned for sport-TOURING you are still better off with the RT, but I know for myself there can be only one other bike in my future aside from my C10...  ;)
 
Steve:

Being as I have both, I am interested in what or how of the three failures you mentioned, of the connie.  Please do let me know, personal message is fine if you choose not to put it here.  From my POV, the beemers handling out-performs all K products. 

I didn't believe it when folks told me that, but after I'd had the LT for a bit and ridden even more beemers, they all had one thing in common, greatly improved handling.  But on the reliability I have to side with K, it has never failed while the B has.  Comfort, B wins again. 

I'm still looking for the "Perfect" (which I doubt will ever exist in my lifetime) so I'll change that to "Highly Improved All Around Motorcycle".  Right now if I had to choose over any large displacement B or K product, it would be the C14.  Why, the power delivery is much smoother and more predictable.  Handling for the C14, it's not a B, but it's getting there.    :)

tcars
John
 
John said:
Steve:

Being as I have both, I am interested in what or how of the three failures you mentioned, of the connie.  Please do let me know, personal message is fine if you choose not to put it here.  From my POV, the beemers handling out-performs all K products. 

I didn't believe it when folks told me that, but after I'd had the LT for a bit and ridden even more beemers, they all had one thing in common, greatly improved handling.  But on the reliability I have to side with K, it has never failed while the B has.  Comfort, B wins again. 

I'm still looking for the "Perfect" (which I doubt will ever exist in my lifetime) so I'll change that to "Highly Improved All Around Motorcycle".  Right now if I had to choose over any large displacement B or K product, it would be the C14.  Why, the power delivery is much smoother and more predictable.  Handling for the C14, it's not a B, but it's getting there.    :)

tcars
John

Hey John,
I don't believe in the 'perfect' bike, only one that suits me best, and I've been very happy with my C10 overall in the seven plus years and 60k miles I've ridden her.  After thoroughly testing the C14 at the National in 2007 I was extremely impressed, but truthfully I've not ridden many other large tourers and so shy from making direct comparison statements; I simply know how amazed and satisfied I was with the C14's performance.

As to the dependability of my C10, again, overall I am quite satisfied with my C10.  The three breakdowns I had were as follows:
  • coolant manifold bolt disappeared en route to Chicago, June '04- shop in Gary IN fixed
  • pull throttle cable snapped in Detroit, Aug '06 iirc- shop in Detroit luckily had one, although local COG'ers tried to help
  • aluminum shaving (from petcock, I believe) stuck carb #1 float needle/valve open on the way home from Moonshine, Apr '08- managed to get it to run well enough to limp home, then pulled carbs myself to clean and added fuel line filter.

There's only been the occasional rear flat since then, and alot of my miles have been in the very cold, very wet or very hot and many urban commuting miles.  Really, I don't think I could ask much more of a bike.  I would think, for the money, the Beemers should be the better bike, but I simply cannot afford them, or the rates for their service.  I buy all my vehicles 'late-model, used' as I do not believe in subsidizing banks and dealers for the depreciation of brand new vehicles, and I need to be able to work on them myself as much as my limited skill set and ability to learn allows- these factors usually preclude Beemers from my choice pool.  Plus, I believe Japanese engineering has matched the Germans for quite some time now, so I feel like I'm getting a good product regardless; where I feel the Germans excel is in their experience in design- producing a vehicle so well suited to it's purpose that it eclipses all others in useability.  In any event I am glad there are choices of bikes to suit all of us looking for different experiences, at various income levels!
 
Gents, thank you all for very interesting and informative responses!

Of course, Connie, or any other bike for that matter, has its own merits and supporters. And it’s great that we all have a choice and can ride the bike we like, want, can afford. But after taking many bikes – FJR, ST1100, ST1300, C14, K1200GT, R1150RT and even old and new GS – for a test ride I came to a very easy decision that the RT is (almost) perfect bike for ME and suits ME way better than any other bike. Have I mentioned “ME” enough times?  :))

As for prices, 2004-2005 R1150RT could be found for $5-6K, at least here in the NE. I did search through many online resources, was patient and finally found 2004 with 8K miles in very good shape in this price range. You are all aware about prices for comparable C10, I guess.  ;)

And, please, I didn’t mean to sound like a BMW guy – I am just a COG guy who found a better bike for his travels.  :)

Ride safe whatever you ride and enjoy!
Alex.
 
Alex,

      Although I already posted in this thread, I would like to add this. I have ridden with you and knowing you like I do. My guess is that you made the correct choice in choosing your 1150RT. I think it was in really nice shape, and appreciate you allowing me to be one of the first people to see it. I know your not going any where. So I only hope that your new bike is nothing but reliable for you! That way you can have many years of enjoyment with it. Maybe we can get out for a ride in the spring! Congrats on a very nice motorcycle!

Bob
 
Best of luck with the new ride  There is one down side Alex. Your bike might not adorn the front of the Concourier.
 
Steve, there is even worse dilemma now – my usual model, Bionic Bob, has become FJR aficionado so I can’t use him and his gone-forever-C14 either. Now I have to force him to rebuild his Silverdammit or else!  >:D  Problems, problems!  :(

But, I am sure we’ll collectively resolve this problem!  8)
 
Oh yeah... forgot about that.  No worries. There are plenty of other member in the Metro NY area.  If you need me to hook you up with someone specific, let me know. Or maybe we'll get some members here on the forum to speak up.
 
Hi,

After a year and 15K miles of 2004 R1150RT ownership, here are my additional notes. Please keep in mind that the following mumbling is my unassuming opinion and your experience maybe shockingly different!  :eek:

The RT continues to impress me with its civilized manners, comfortable ride, versatility, ability to carry on for long distances without exhausting the rider, plenty of usable storage space, good look, one of the best riding position out of all motorcycles I’ve ridden, 6th gear, powerful brakes, infinitely adjustable and extremely practical power windshield, good fairing protection and distinctive opposite twin personality. It even brings my artistic inspiration up a notch – a link to the constantly growing RT image gallery is in my signature. The number of miles I’ve put on this bike in a year may not be a great deal for someone who rides long distances or year-round but for occasional, weekends-only riding it shows how VERY comfortable and enjoyable the RT is for me. To the point that I may perhaps ride to Vermont for lunch and come back to Manhattan full of energy in time for dinner - on the same Saturday and taking only local roads both ways!  :beerchug:  I’ve never made similar long-distance-short-time leaps on Connie without returning completely exhausted.  :sleepy:

Now, let me go back to that 6th gear for a minute. Well, this feature is kind of tricky. On one hand, the 6th gear is great at speeds above 60 miles per hour. The bike just cruises along, engine purrs and everything is beautiful. I don’t think I have ever searched for the 7th gear with the RT. But below 60 mile per hour the overwhelmed opposite twin engine can’t effectively pull in 6th and you are forced to drop to 5th gear. However, at this borderline speed between 55 and 60 and corresponding rpms the RT starts to vibrate just a bit too much for comfortable riding over any long stretches. The sensible solution for this “55 to 60” issue would be to make the gap between 5th and 6th gear a bit smaller. But then I would probably start to complain about 6th being too short for highway cruising.  ;D  BMW meant for this bike to be used on almost-unlimited-speed autobahns of Europe, therefore tall overdrive gear, but with our pathetic 55 (and even 65) miles per hour speed limit the 6th gear is often too much of a good thing. Notwithstanding this small issue, riding this bike is a joy!

BMW of Manhattan has already performed major service on this bike and Max BMW (NY) did small electrical installation when I was on my way from COG National rally in Vermont. Aside from monetary soreness I had good experience with both dealers - the staff was knowledgeable, skilled and friendly.  At Max they have added oil to the engine and adjusted air in tires without being asked and for free - nice touch.   

Ride safe whatever you ride and enjoy!  :motonoises:
Alex.
 
While I appreciate that the bmw has a higher level of technology, It's also a newer model motorcycle. Probably better to compare it to a c-14 than a c-10. OTOH, I'd gladly compare Shoodaben to the bmw's - fact is that a c-10 that's been massaged will answer all of th issues you've raised. Yeah, I know that you can just buy the updated bike outright, bt I think alot of folks like to mod thier bike to thier own tastes, and in that, the c-10 is KING! steve
 
Two of my long term riding buddies have several BMW oil heads.  I came close to buying one of them but it seemed to have excessive driveline lash and when he told me about the new $400 fuel pump he had to buy for his other bike it all became crystal clear that I am a frugal Connie owner and will continue to be for some time.  Just like the cheap UJM's of the 80's, there will come a day when the nice cheap C10's will dry up and everyone will be thinkin back when  :'(           
 
Not to pee on Beemers (cause I like them a lot) but up here the location of dealerships is few and far between.

Case in point: I met a guy on a 2011 R1200 RT (I think).  He loved the bike but told me what a pain it was to have serviced.  He was from Sudbury, and his nearest dealer was in Toronto (say 250 miles).  He had just got back from having his warranty servicing and found his oil gauge had crapped out.

Back to the stealer.

p.s. Alex, your photo website is pure gold.  I hope you have become very wealthy off your considerable talents.
 
Steve in Sunny Fla said:
...Probably better to compare it to a c-14 than a c-10...

Steve, thanks for your comments and you may be right, but I think R1150RT is more comparable to sport-TOURING C10 than to SPORT-touring C14. Although the “oilhead” RT was first introduced as R1100RT in 1994, BMW opposite twin design is very old and produces comparable to C10 hp/torque. C14 is different animal altogether in that aspect having engine almost twice as powerful and may compare better to latest generation of BMW K-bikes. The RT, of course, benefited from advanced technology but it’s not radically different from C10 in terms of ergonomics and overall “feel”. Besides, my goal was to compare bikes I have firsthand experience with and perhaps help someone who is thinking of the same transition.  ::)

Hogboy said:
….Alex, your photo website is pure gold.  I hope you have become very wealthy off your considerable talents.
Piotr, thank you, my friend, every such comment is priceless!…  :beerchug:  As far as accumulation of wealth – it’s all in Tugriks…  ;D
 
I agree with Alex on the his 1150RT being closer to the C10 than C14.BMW's lack of dealers close to me, keeps me from really considering a BMW. The closest dealer for me now is over an hour away. That's just too far for me to pick up a part or drop off the bike for service. Alex is lucky enough to have them around fairly close. But he's right. His bike is very nice. Although I haven't ridden it.
 
Cap'n Bob said:
I agree with Alex on the his 1150RT being closer to the C10 than C14.BMW's lack of dealers close to me, keeps me from really considering a BMW. The closest dealer for me now is over an hour away. That's just too far for me to pick up a part or drop off the bike for service. Alex is lucky enough to have them around fairly close. But he's right. His bike is very nice. Although I haven't ridden it.

  I wasn't referring to the engine power, but to stuff like abs, modern tires and suspension, etc. The c-10 is pretty dated in those areas these days. BTW I've had mine to 140+ with a big ceebailey shield, and it was rock-solid. It's rock solid in dirty air, too. the problem isn't the bike per se, it's really the tires and suspension setup. Those things can all be fixed, which is a good thing -  Steve
 
I just picked up an '96 R1100RT  a couple of weeks ago and love it!  Agree with your assessment Alex.  Love the comfort, love the handling, miss the power.  What really surprised me was the lack of grunt below 4K RPMs.  I expected a high displacement, low revving twin to pull nicely out of corners at 2.5 - 3K RPM -- that's not the case.  It really does not like to be run below 3K.  Still adore the bike and the power plant -- I was just expecting something a little different!  Perhaps a Guzzi is in my future!  :motonoises:
 
tvpierce said:
...What really surprised me was the lack of grunt below 4K RPMs.

I have noticed that too after switching to RT, went to various BMW boards and found few claims that opposite twins are much happier in higher rpms. Drop to one lower gear that you would expect to use with Connie and all will fall into right places... WelKome to the dark side and enjoy you RT - it’s a fine machine.  :motonoises:
 
I moved this thread over to other motorcycle from the C10 section, because it really is more of a RT thread than staying on a C10 / RT comparison.
 
Things I don't like about my '04 1150RT -
Power brakes that might work well in a pinch but lack feel at stop light rolling speed.  (Not crazy about C14 brakes either but for different reasons).
Way too soft, rocking horse suspension with the accepted fix being a pair of $800+ shocks.  I have marks on the top of my front fender.
Absolutely hate the turn signal and cancel switches.
If you're 'busy' in a corner and need to downshift without using the clutch, chances are you won't be able to.

On the other hand...  more comfortable for slab riding with the right seat than a C14 and a better babe magnet (for babes over 50).
:))
 
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