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No Spark HELP

killingbugs

killingbugs

Member
Member
I am trying to revive a early ZX900, (same igition as the C-10).
I have No Spark, I show 12v at the coil red wires.
I have the proper resisitance at the coils. (2,6)
The Pick up coils have the proper resisitance.
I checked and set the gap on the pick-up coils'
I swapped the Igniter box out with a known good one,

And still no spark.... can the kill switch keep it from sparking and still crank the starter?
Kick stand switch??
HELP
 
No spark on any cyl? If true I would be looking more at primary wiring, check the connection to the igniter, probably some corrosion there.
 
The system should not crank with the kill switch enabled.Always check the simple things first,check continuity on every wire in that set of circuits to make sure you don't have a broken wire.Yes,if it has had a kickstand switch installed it would keep it from firing if it was bad.Although they usually work with the the bike in first gear before it shuts the bike down for safety reasons.Also make sure you have GOOD grounds,connections that are clean and tight and that you have the most obvious....live coil wires to the plugs.Finally....check the plugs.Believe it or not I have personally replaced 5 sets of plugs that were brand new and from the same production run that were bad.(Though highly unlikely since that was 20 years ago)  ;D
 
Well I didn't have time to look at it today.
But I did just repair a wire on the kickstand switch. But that should not kill the spark unless it is in gear.
Neutral safety works will not crank in gear, and the kill switch kills the starter.
I checked resistance to the pick-up coils so no broken wires.
I cleaned the ignitor?ECU connections when I tried the box from the known running bike.
Should there be 12V at both spade connectors at the coil?

I will check for spark at other cyclinders as soon as it gets a little warmer in the garage.

 
WITH THE KEY ON... Try just tapping a grounded wire against the - terminal of a coil to see if the plug sparks (breaking the completed circuit will collapse the field in the primary inducing the spark).  If it has 12v on the + side and doesn't spark, it's a coil/wire/plug  If it does spark, then it's the pickups/wiring/igniter.

All of that said, the odds of neither coil firing are pretty high.  It's not likely BOTH coils would go bad.  Just as unlikely both pickups would go bad.  And ALMOST as unlikely that both channels in the igniter would go bad.  However, there are other things that can go wrong with the igniter that WOULD stop both cylinders from sparking.


Edited to add the first all caps phrase.
 
The kill switch would keep the motor from spinning over. If it wasn't spinning over, he probably wouldn't be at the point of "no spark". Just an observation.  ;)
 
RevRider I have spark when I ground the coil with the key on.
With no spark at either coil, it must be igniter, or wires.

Someone mentioned the junction box. I looked at the wiring diagram and it looks like the only break in the JB that would shutdown the igniter would kill most of the rest of the system.

P.S. the headlight comes one with the key, not after the starter has been bumped????
 
Bikejunkie59 said:
P.S. the headlight comes one with the key, not after the starter has been bumped????
Click to expand...

RED FLAG RED FLAG RED FLAG

EIther you have some bare wires crossed somewhere or there is something funky in the J-box OR someone has been doing some re-wiring on your bike.  This may or may not be related to your no spark, but it is not a proper function for the light to come on with the switch.  I would start chasing after that a little to see where it takes me.  Two electrical problems may well have a related cause.  I don;t have time right now to study the schematic of the J-box and headlamp wiring, but...
 
It has a reserve lighting box on the fairing frame. I have cleaned the wiring connectors for the ignition switch, and all other small harnesses.
I may unplug the reserve lighting box and see if it helps.

No Hurry is was 14 degrees when I got up this morning and I have a GREAT C-14 ready to go. But this mystery is killing me :truce:
 
Another thought about the spark issue.

The igniter has two channels.  One fires one coil the other the other coil.  IF there is power to the igniter (red wire coming from coils) and ground coming from the J-box (Green wire with Black stripe) then it is most likely only one channel would fail.  Since the pickup coils operate independantly as well, it's unlikely both would fail.  So given both power and ground to the Igniter it is unlikely both channels would fail, though there are a couple of internal possibilities that it COULD kill both sides by losing power or ground inside the igniter.  Swapping a known good igniter would be the ideal test or better yet, swap your igniter onto a known running bike to see if it still runs.  Same way with the J-box.  Swap onto a well running bike and if it still runs, yours should to so that is not the problem.

Since the bike fires when grounding and breaking the ground on the coils, you know that the problem is in the triggering side of the coils.  So, that is something and elimnates coils, wires, plugs, ignition switch, and kill switch as being the problem.  You really are gaining, but not quite there yet.
 
My first guess is going to be .............  hmmmm...... Do this first.

1. Unplug the igniter and with the switch on, check the red wire at the plug for 12v.  If none, check for break in wire between ignition coils and the igniter plug.  If good go to 2.

2.  Check for ground at igniter plug at Green wire with black Stripe.  If none, check for ground at neutral safety switch.  If no there's a problem.  Also check for continuity between sidestand switch wires.  The Brown and Black wires should show continuity when the sidestand is up and none when down.  If this is not the case, clean the sidestand switch... one of the few things WD40 is really pretty good at.

If there is no ground at the Green/w Black wire at the igniter, you could jump it to ground and check for fire.  If there is no ground there, but there IS ground at the light green wire going into teh J-box, the J-box is the culprit.

Sorry this isn;t more eloquent.  it's kinda off the top of my head, but I think it troubleshoots about all of the possibilities.  I didnt mention the starter lockout at the clutch since he neutral safety switch should over-ride it.  Make sure the bike is in neutral when doing all testing.

EDITED TO ADD:
I cannot see a relationship between firing and the light thing.
 
OK I checked the Red wire at the ignitor and have 12V
I check continuity from the 4 wires leading to the pick-up coils.
The pick-up coils measured with in range for resistance.

I will check green wire for ground by jumping from pos battery terminal to the green/black wire??

Then if that checks out I will remove the junction box and check it out.
Is there a plug in wiring harness on the back of the block??
I assumed that if the power was not getting out of the J-Box I would not get spark jumping the coil to ground??
 
If you have power at the ignitor (the 12v red one) then the J-box is delivering voltage to the ignition switch.  From there the power goes to the kill switch, branches off for the starter switch with the main red from the kill switch going to the coils.  The igniter is NOT the source of voltage to the coils.  On the early bikes it comes directly from the Ignition switch to kill switch, on 94 and later ones it comes from the J-box to kill switch then the coils.  THEN the voltage comes to the igniter from the coils in both cases.  Since you have voltage there, the J-box is probably a non-player in your no fire issue.  It COULD be a player in the headlight thing.

Now, since you have power to the igniter and the pickups appear to check out at least resistance wise, the ground issue is at hand.  Try this.  Just take the Green with black stripe wire coming out of the igniter and ground it somehow.  THen check for fire.  If none, then it is definitely in the igniter or ignition pickup system.  But you said you had swapped out the igniter with a known good one and the pickups appear OK, so I'm really thinking this ground thing (safety switches) is the culprit.  Give it a go and let us know what happens.
 
Bikejunkie59 said:
I will check green wire for ground by jumping from pos battery terminal to the green/black wire??
Click to expand...

NO WAIT
Just grond the Green/Black wire to teh frame, engine, or battery. BUT DO NOT CONNECT it to the POSITIVE terminal of the battery.
 
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